Posted by canotarygal on 12/17/08 1:20am
Msg #272072
Reverse Mortgage Billing
Normally I bill the escrow company direct, 200.00 for a RM. I had my invoice returned because an underwriter, insiisted that I could only charge 40.00 for the notary. The escrow officer called me and asked if I could rebill , @ 40.00 for the notary fee and 160.00 for the "signing fee". It was not a problem, but I have never had this happen in the last four years. Anyone one else ever have this happen to them?
| Reply by PAW on 12/17/08 5:02am
Msg #272074
State laws are usually pretty clear on what a notary can charge for notarial services. Some auditors and underwriters are pretty keen on scrutinizing charges for services, especially in today's climate.
In Florida, it is recommended by the Secretary of State (pg 9 of the manual), that an itemized bill be presented for services to eliminate the perception of over-charging for services rendered.
| Reply by Marian_in_CA on 12/17/08 5:36am
Msg #272075
You should keep those items separate in your billing practices, even if nobody has ever mentioned it to you before. The lack of someone bringing it to your attention does not mean it hasn't been an issue. A Notary fee is just that... a notary fee. If you notarized four times, CA law says you cannot charge more than $40 for that. So if an auditor or anyone else down the road questions that, it could ultimately end up with the Secretary of State yanking your commission for overcharging. You NEVER want an invoice, receipt or other document to reflect that you charged more than the maximum notarization fees. If you charge $200 for notary fees, then you better have at least 20 notarizations in your journal to match.
How do you document the fees in your journal?
Your invoices should be pretty clear, but you don't have to charge exactly for each notarization. In fact, some people might get uppity about that and try to reduce your fees.
Some ways to list it:
---------------------
Signing Fees: $200.00
---------------------
Notary Public Fees: $40.00
Signing Fees: $160.00
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Notary Public Fees: $60.00 (6 documents notarized)
Notary Public Fee Discount: -$20.00 discount
E-Doc Fees: $30.00
Signing Fees: $100.00
Extended Travel Fee: $30.00
----------------------
It all depends on how you come to your $200 fee. Personally, the more detailed you are, the better because you can then justify the rates you charge. It is also nice to show the "discount" (if applicable) because it shows the value of your service.
Remember, though, if you itemize your fees like that, then you need to make sure it matches in your journal. So if you notarized 6 docs, but only charge $40... then each "notary fee" would be $8.00 rather than $10.00. In cases where you just charge a generic "signing fee", you could always mark the notary fee as $0 and then just note a signing fee of $200 for the entire job in your notes.
Whatever you do, keep it consistent... and never charge a "notary fee" for more than the maximum for the actual number of notarizations performed. The last thing you want is a surprise from the SoS accusing you of overcharging for notary fees.
By the way... if anyone paying for your services *does* request an accounting of your specific notary fees...you are required to give it to them, or they could sue you for 3 times the amount. Check page 39 of the handbook:
"§ 6109. Receipt of fees; written account; officer liability
Every officer of a county or judicial district, upon receiving any fees for official duty
service, may be required by the person paying the fees to make out in writing and to deliver
to the person a particular account of the fees. The account shall specify for what the
respectively, accrued, and the officer shall receipt it. If the officer refuses or neglects to
when required, he is liable to the person paying the fees in treble the amount so paid."
So, there's another incentive for making sure that you keep your "notary fees" distinct and clear.
| Reply by Teddog/CO on 12/17/08 6:19am
Msg #272076
Very well broken down Marian and good advice. 
Happy Holidays !!!
| Reply by Teresa/FL on 12/17/08 6:54am
Msg #272079
Don't forget that notaries do not have to pay self-employment tax to the IRS on income received for notarial acts. I always note the number of notarizations performed for each assignment and separate the notarial fee portion from the signing agent/printing/travel portion to make it easier for me to prepare my tax return.
| Reply by Patricia/VT on 12/17/08 9:13am
Msg #272082
Marian, I understood that California allowed a notary fee of $10 per signature notarized.
| Reply by Marian_in_CA on 12/17/08 10:26am
Msg #272088
Up to $10, yes...but not required. Often...
for "bulk" jobs, it makes sense to reduce the fee charged per oath, seal, etc. The examples I cited are just that... examples, since every package is different.
It's also a good bargaining tool when negotiating fees from the low ballers, too. If you are offered $50, and you think (or know) one of their packages will have, let's say 5 notarizations... you can tell them, "$50 will only cover the notary fees, and I also charge for travel, signing, time etc."
| Reply by Marian_in_CA on 12/17/08 10:30am
Msg #272089
Oh, yeah! Don't forget the IRS. Thanks Teresa! n/m
| Reply by Charles Pratt on 12/17/08 9:05am
Msg #272080
Hi there,
Just a general question. Many of the assignments I receive in Maryland are already priced via the signing company and I have no idea how many notarizations are going to be performed within each assignment until I get there. Even if I print e-docs, usually there is not enough time to review this prior to the closing. Not to sound naive or ignorant, but should I be counting the number of notarizations or number of signatures? Thanks for not pelting me with stones.
CTP
| Reply by LynnNC on 12/17/08 9:23am
Msg #272083
You count the number of signatures notarized. I keep an Excel spreadsheet that shows my total fee and the amount that is for notarizations, which I take from my notary journal prepared at closing. I use the same spreadsheet to record my mileage and the amount and date of invoices paid.
| Reply by CopperheadVA on 12/17/08 11:37am
Msg #272097
I believe it is state-specific. Here in VA we can charge up to $5.00 per "act". So if there's one or 100 signatures all notarized within the the same notarial certificate, then all I can charge is $5.00.
| Reply by PAW on 12/17/08 2:24pm
Msg #272129
You need to be able to extract notary fees for tax purposes
When you do your taxes (Federal return), the "notary fee" can be excluded from the Self-Employment tax computation. Unless you separate the fee out of each signing performed, you won't know how much you can exclude.
For example, if you do a $50 signing and there are 6 documents requiring notarization, and you are allowed to charge $10 per notarization, your "allowable" exclusion would be $50 (the maximum you earned for the signing). However, if you are only allowed $2 per notarization, then the "allowable" exclusion would be $12. The remaining $38 would be subject to SE Tax. (Of course, this does not take into account any reductions to your net income for allowable expenses, taken on Schedule C.) See Schedules C and SE for more details.
| Reply by canotarygal on 12/20/08 12:43pm
Msg #272525
Great Feedback..Happy Holidays and Much Success in 2009! n/m
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