Posted by Leon_CO on 12/5/08 2:54pm
Msg #271187

Tell the whole story behind payment issues

I occasionally see a post where someone will say, 'XYZ company doesn't pay', or 'ABC company is at 30+ days and still waiting n/m ...'

But what are the circumstances?

What efforts did you make to collect? Did you follow all the rules? Did the company receive a W9, if requested? If the invoice was supposed to be faxed, did they actually receive the fax? Etc.

This is not to say that there aren't slow/no paying companies. But there may be a reason why payment is delayed. And signing agents want to be able to make an informed decision, and not rush to judgement.

Providing the whole story is a service to your fellow signing agents, and it's fair to the companies involved.

P.S. I did a closing on November 28th for one of the companies mentioned today as being slow pay (MeyMax). I called today to confirm that they had received my 'Signing Invoice Sheet'. They did. I was told that the check went out today -- a week after the closing.

Reply by Ilene C. Seidel on 12/5/08 3:18pm
Msg #271188

Well goody for you. The majority of us on this site are seasoned professionals and know what's required to receive payment. The only way we can protect each other from SS and Title companies scamming us is to keep this site updated. You obviously don't need to.

Reply by Derrick/MT on 12/5/08 3:50pm
Msg #271191

Ilene, I think Leon makes a good point. I do not think he was attacking you in the sense that you where not doing a good job in collecting. I think he was more saying that people have different experiences with a SS or TC than others and by giving the whole picture of your efforts to get money from them will help us all make an educated decision to work for them in the future.
Just as an example when I look up a company on signing central it drives me crazy when I see someone rate a company 4 stars and the comment they give is slow pay. Nothing is said about what is there definition of slow pay and what was there efforts to collect the money.
I think Leon is making the same point by saying that he is hoping people will give more information on there efforts because some people define things differently.

Reply by TRG_wy on 12/5/08 4:11pm
Msg #271194

I agree that sometimes more info would be nice.

The process of "collection efforts" on our part gets me. My terms are net 30 days. Often it will be 45 days plus before I start checking my payment status. At 60+ days I tend to get irate. I should NOT have to spend time trying to collect fees for services rendered and out-of-pocket expenses paid up front by me to see the closing completed. I am not in the business to fund upfront those costs. If things drag on beyond when the borrower has already made their first payment on the new loan then something is wrong somewhere in ensuring I am paid.

Collection of over due invoices is not part of what I should be spending my time doing.

Reply by Derrick/MT on 12/5/08 5:02pm
Msg #271197

I totally agree with you on the collections part. I hate to waste time collecting money, but it has become a part of our business.

Reply by Steven Pearce on 12/6/08 10:23am
Msg #271240

Agreed! I could complain that my payment is 60 days

past due from one agency, but I should mention that I was not aware that I am supposed to use their 'once a month' invoice. - My fault or theirs?

The other agency (very reputable) apologized profusely and said they would send out a payment immediately.

The more we know from BOTH sides, the more clarity we have in making decisions who to work for.

Reply by TRG_wy on 12/6/08 11:12am
Msg #271251

Re: Agreed! I could complain that my payment is 60 days

"past due from one agency, but I should mention that I was not aware that I am supposed to use their 'once a month' invoice. - My fault or theirs?"

Good point too. I do not do business with companys that require end-of-month billing. I learned a long time ago that this requires too much effort on my accounting to remember who does it and if I forget to send it in within their three day window I am out of luck for yet another billing cycle. This floods their accounting dept and slows my check even more. I have found that in general, these outfits can delay my payment out 60-90 days and not even blink.

Sorry, but my expenses are immediate and I can not afford to let monies due me get protracted out up to three months.

Reply by Todd/OH on 12/6/08 6:50pm
Msg #271302

I kinda side with Ilene

Many of us have been doing this for a long time. There are slow-payers and others fake it with excuses. They're both a waste of time. We'd rather not deal with them. We ID them quickly and move on to those we trust.

Reply by ChristineHI on 12/5/08 9:06pm
Msg #271213

Well, I have been in the business for 18 years as a loan processor, underwriter and signing agent. I usually know more about the business than the people I do work for.
In my case, I definately do what is necessary for payment. In this market, I have started to refuse signings for companies and continually pay late.
If I haven't had personal experience with a company I look at all the ratings and see what the pattern is. There are some who continually pay late. If there are only a couple late ones than I will ask the company about it before taking the signing to see what the circumstances were if possible.
In the list you are only allowed a couple of lines so you cannot go into detail.
The thing is companies should never pay late. If they are going to be late they should contact the notary and let them know what is happening. If they need something they need to tell the notary and communicate their needs.
When a notary puts a comment about a late payment on there it is because it was late! I can tell you that if you were called by the company apologizing for the delay etc. most people would not write bad reviews. They may say it is late but they would perhaps be more understanding.
From my extensive experience, notary companies that are reputable and the ones I like to work for will not be late in the first place. They appreciate my work and treat me like the professional that I am.
I communicate extensively with companies even after closing to make sure they have all they need.
The notary company should be proactive if they do need something that is going to delay a payment to the notary.
I would assume that is a majority of the cases the notary has done what is necessary to be paid on time. Of course there are exceptions, but again, if the company is going to have any delays they should be contacting the notary about it.
If a signing agent feels they were taken care of, even if payment was late, I doubt you will read bad comments about them. There are signing agents who don't care about why a payment is late, but if the company tells me the problem, is apologetic and it doesn't happen again I will be understanding.....one time.
To me, I trust the notary information because in most cases I do think the notary has done all they can and they just aren't getting paid. This is especially true if you see a lot of negative comments. Just imagine too that these are only people who do comment. There many many people out there that don't say anything either.
In conclusion, I look for a pattern. I look at the positive and the negative and see what the "average" is.
It has worked so far, I have done about 11,000 signings in my career and have never not been paid.
Trust your judgement and intuition. That is the best we can do.
Thanks for the post..good reminder for notaries out there.
Aloha from sunny Maui

Reply by Teddog/CO on 12/6/08 10:47am
Msg #271245

ChristineHI

Christine I agree with 100%. I feel the same way 30 days to pay is plenty of time. There is no reason for a notary to wait for their payment any longer then 30 days. We all need to remember that we are running a business. It is mandatory that we be paid in a timely manner like every other business. We have our monthly bills to pay if we do not pay them by the Due Date we are in trouble and charged a late fee. A Notary business can't take the chance of letting people get to a 45 or 60 day late payment situation. Late payers are time consuming not to mention they are potential No Pays.
Just my opinion. Stay on top of your invoices so you don't get "Burned." We are now in a time that businesses close their doors overnight.

Like you Christine if they are late never work for them again. You save yourself time, money, a lot of aggravation.

Reply by ChristineHI on 12/6/08 8:18pm
Msg #271307

Re: ChristineHI

Yes. Except for my regular clients who always pay me, I always check on status about a week after closing to make sure all is going smoothly and confirm that payment is running on time and to confirm if they need anything. If they respond with an affirmative then I check on the day check is supposed to go out to make sure it did indeed go out. You would be surprised how many aren't! I think they are shocked sometimes of how detailed I am, but it is my business and I take it seriously.
At that point then hopefully the check will arrive shortly thereafter.
I am in constant communication so they have many chances to inform me of any delays etc so I don't have any patience for delays anymore. I am an understanding person, but a business person as well.
I want to be treated as the professional that I am and my regular clients so that...and I take very good care of them so they will send me more business.
Better to lose a couple of signings to disreputable companies than to waste time trying to collect a couple hundred dollars.
Anyway, let's not be desperate even in desperate times....in the end you are the one who pays in your time and energy and your pocketbook will feel it.
Good luck all! The year is almost over...hopefully 2009 will be better! And please post comments good and bad on the signing list. A lot of us rely on the list for information so make sure it is accurate. It helps us all a lot!!!
It is easy to forget good comments, but those are important as well. It is not just a list for complaints, but compliments too! I make it a point after most signings to post something about my experience..just to help others and keep the information current.
Aloha everyone!