Posted by Simon Close on 2/1/08 2:04pm
Msg #233616

Clearsource Title and UPS backcharges

Is anyone else's UPS account being charged for Clearsource title charges? I want to warn all of you not to do business with this company. Not only did UPS charge my account for their nonpayment and account closure, but they have ignored me (primarily) and according to UPS, they are not trying to work this out with them as they told me. UPS says they closed their account and that was the last of it, so any charges are billed back to the shippers. Anyone else have any idea how to get Clearsource's attention? Anyway, beware everyone. They are still doing business even though they aren't paying their bills.

Reply by LKT/CA on 2/1/08 2:14pm
Msg #233620

I was told never to put my return address on shipping labels....to put the recipient info in both the TO and FROM areas that way (just in case), they'll have to pay either way. Does UPS or FedEx not accept the package unless there is different TO and FROM information?

Reply by Simon Close on 2/1/08 2:18pm
Msg #233621

No you are right, the best way to avoid this is to put them as both shipper and receiver on a handwritten label. It was so much easier to do the labels online and these chargebacks are from many many months ago! It's just infuriating and I want to be sure everyone knows it's probably a bad idea to do business with them because I'm sure it'll soon be very difficult to get paid by them if they aren't paying their courier bills.

Reply by CopperheadVA on 2/1/08 3:04pm
Msg #233630

I got charged back in October 2007 on a shipment from August 2007 to First Merit Settlement Services. When I did the UPS label on-line in August, UPS.com did not indicate the account was closed. In October, I received an invoice saying the account was closed, so I got hit with the charge back for shipping plus a $10 charge-back fee. See message # 217051 for details. UPS doesn't care if you were told to use the number - you as the shipper are ultimately responsible for the charges.

I finally did receive reimbursement from the TC for the entire chargeback bill, but it was a real hassle. Now I only use handwritten airbills and the TC or SS name goes in the "FROM" and the TC goes in the "TO". With so many companies folding, everyone must use extreme caution when shipping - look how many notaries were left with UPS chargebacks from EFS. (Luckily, I used FedEx with EFS and for some reason I never received a chargeback.) Especially with UPS, apparently just because the account # is good the day you ship the package, it can still come back to bite you much later.

Reply by Emilia/NJ on 2/1/08 3:12pm
Msg #233631

Never, ever use your online UPS account to prepare airbills. Take a bunch of blank airbills from UPS and Fed Ex and hand write the same information for To and From, i.e the receivers info. Otherwise, you take a big chance in being billed - if these opeople have either closed their accounts or refuse to pay their bills.

Reply by Doris_CO on 2/1/08 3:21pm
Msg #233633

I have blank forms that I ordered under my accounts for UPS and FedEx. I only use those if I'm familiar with the company and have had no problems with shipping. If it's a new company to me, I have a supply of blank forms that I picked up from UPS and/or FedEx hubs and use those since they can't be traced back to me by tracking number. I use the TC or SS name in both "from" and "to" address blocks. Even if you fill in the SS or TC's name in both places but use your own blank forms, the company can use the tracking number to bill you if the receiving company doesn't pay for shipping.

Reply by LisaWI on 2/1/08 3:32pm
Msg #233637

Dont trust UPS, they charged me 4 times last year for no mistake of mine. I had to call to get them to remove the charges and it was a pain. So now I do the TO and FROM just like everyone is saying even to the comps I know.

Reply by CaliNotary on 2/1/08 4:32pm
Msg #233647

"I only use those if I'm familiar with the company and have had no problems with shipping. "

These days you're foolish to even do that. Lots of familiar and reputable companies have shut their doors with no notice and if it happens to one of yours you're gonna be stuck. The cost of convenience could very well end up being MUCH higher than you expected it to be.

Reply by Kathy/ID on 2/1/08 8:29pm
Msg #233697

I put the to and from the person I am shipping to but on the UPS forms you have to sign the bottom of them. What are you guys doing there?

Reply by CaliNotary on 2/1/08 9:33pm
Msg #233716

My signature isn't much more than a scribble so I just sign it. Just make it illegible, it's not like they could track you down without an address anyway.

Reply by Ernest__CT on 2/1/08 11:01pm
Msg #233736

"Michael Mouse" n/m

Reply by CopperheadVA on 2/3/08 4:13pm
Msg #233897

I never sign there - I just leave it blank. I do put the date in, but no signature.

Reply by CaliNotary on 2/1/08 4:29pm
Msg #233646

"Anyone else have any idea how to get Clearsource's attention? "

You're kidding, right? They know exactly what they did, you're just screwed and stuck eating the cost. If UPS couldn't work it out with them it's highly unlikely that you'll get any further than they did. So don't waste time and money chasing it down, just write it off and be done with it.

Reply by Cari on 2/1/08 6:14pm
Msg #233677

I tried signing up with them, before reading all of this and here's what I got as a reply in email:

Unfortunately we are not able to do business in the State of Illinois. Sorry.

Dana A. McLaughlin - Escrow Agent
Clear Source Title Agency
248-357-1700 - office
248-224-2304 - cell
866-490-9983 - fax

WONDER WHY???

Reply by BrendaTx on 2/2/08 8:49am
Msg #233778

Cari...

**WONDER WHY???**

Might be legend or urban myth but my recollection is that there's some kind of legal problem with running a signing service in Illinois.

Reply by Tony_FL on 2/1/08 10:35pm
Msg #233731

What about the borrower?

While I haven't done it myself, I received an o/n packet from a title company last week where they included a return Fedex envelope for me to ship the documents in.

They had already included a return shipping label where THEY listed the shipper as the Borrower and the receiver as the title company.

Your thoughts?

Reply by Ernest__CT on 2/1/08 11:02pm
Msg #233737

If the label is pre-printed, don't change it. Period. n/m

Reply by MikeC/NY on 2/2/08 7:43am
Msg #233761

Re: What about the borrower?

<< They had already included a return shipping label where THEY listed the shipper as the Borrower and the receiver as the title company. >>

I had a similar experience, and was told that many companies who include preprinted FedEx labels will create it as a "return", which means their account is charged even though the borrower (or notary) is listed as the shipper. Which makes sense, since they need a valid shipper number in order to create the label in the first place...