Posted by Chris Meeks on 1/10/08 12:48pm
Msg #229992

Need to quit complaining

you people, seriously need to quit complaining, with the current market the way it is and alot of lenders are closing down and going bankrupt. I'm sure the signing services are having a hard time getting their payments too. luckily some of them are still open and are trying to make payment arrangements so I can get paid. But I realize that this is the type of bussiness I choose to do. So I accept that the mortgage industry can go up or down and just go with it. Remember we are independent contractors, yes the companies are obligated to pay us, but with that we also take a risk. Some of you notaries seriously need to find some other more stable work if you cant hack this. you just gotta suck it up and carry on.

Reply by ZeeCA on 1/10/08 12:52pm
Msg #229993

are you a ss? defending why notaries don't get paid? I smell a troll....

Reply by DebbieT on 1/10/08 12:53pm
Msg #229994

I dont think it is complaining. I would call it being informative.

Reply by docs1954CA on 1/10/08 1:05pm
Msg #229995

Complaining????

What exactly are you talking about? Complaining about lying, cheating SS they ignore us when it's time to pay for services rendered? Are we complaining about the lack of business? No....You have it all wrong.This site is meant to be informative, thought sharing forum. Somewhere where we as professional people can share our experiences,thoughts and ideas. Is that you Howdy doo doo?

Reply by docs1954CA on 1/10/08 1:10pm
Msg #229997

And one more thing...

We DO take risks.Driving in nasty weather..going to strangers stinky homes late at night.I can think of several more, and I'm sure others can too...The SS make as much as 3 times the money we do for making some phone calls...we aren't in partnership with them, so why in the world should we share in their risks?????

Reply by Carmi/CA on 1/10/08 1:12pm
Msg #229998

AMEN! n/m

Reply by Chris Meeks on 1/10/08 1:22pm
Msg #229999

Re: And one more thing...

"so why in the world should we share in their risks?????"

Well for one thing we do share their risk, we take the risk of taking a signing job and getting paid for it. Last time I checked that is what being an independent contractor is about. I remember the last time the housing market took a slump and did not get paid for alot of signings I did due to the signing services went bankrupt. all I am saying is, try to work out a payment option with the signing services that are still open and be greatfull if they arrange something with you, because they could very easily now go bankrupt and then you would not get paid for sure.

Reply by SueW/Tn on 1/10/08 1:27pm
Msg #230000

Nods in agreement, they COULD go bankrupt AND

open up the next day like Mick has done, owing hundreds of SA's but free and clear working under another name. Don't be grateful, be diligent.

Reply by docs1954CA on 1/10/08 1:51pm
Msg #230005

I see your point Chris,

but the risk of not being paid is one we shouldn't have to take.The SS have to take that risk alone.Too bad they don't get paid, but since they are making a HUGE profit, they can more then afford it then we can.I don't think most of us doing this for a living like to lose money on deals that don't fund for any reason. Now if they want to pay us $500.00 for each closing with no pay for no close, I'd give that some serious thought.
I agree with you Sue, but what we need now is a crystal ball....

Reply by Sylvia_FL on 1/10/08 1:56pm
Msg #230007

Re: I see your point Chris,

Some SS don't make a HUGE profit.

But, I agree, a Signing Service should ALWAYS pay their signing agents. I have been stung by a title company (Central Escrow for those that are interested), however I always pay the signing agent full fee. It isn't the signing agents fault if the loan doesn't get signed, or doesn't fund. It really isn't the title company's fault either. The fault lies with the LO who sold the loan and lied to the borrower about the terms etc.

Reply by desktopfull on 1/10/08 2:16pm
Msg #230012

Re: Here's another point

I can't tell you how many SS's get paid by the TC or lender and still stiff the SA. To many to count, here's one example: Document Closer's- worked with them for years, accepted 3 closings from them in August and they've disappeared off the map. TC says they paid them for the closing and apologizes saying there is nothing they can't do, I guess they followed the example of their original boss who trained them. His remarks when finallly reached was "you can't get blood out of a turnip, I was incorporated so you can't touch me and the corporation was dissolved." I never expected them to follow his example.

Reply by desktopfull on 1/10/08 2:46pm
Msg #230024

Re: Here's another point, (fixing errors)

I can't tell you how many SS's get paid by the TC or lender and still stiff the SA. To many to count, here's one example: Document Closer's- worked with them for years, accepted 3 closings from them in August and they've disappeared off the map. TC says they paid them for the closing and apologizes saying there is nothing they can do, I guess they followed the example of their original boss who trained them. He simply closed the doors, locked his employees(founder's of DCI) out, not even telling them he was shutting down, their notice was a note taped on the door when they showed up for work the next day. His remarks when finallly reached was "you can't get blood out of a turnip, I was incorporated so you can't touch me and the corporation was dissolved." I never expected them to follow his example. If you can prove the SS got paid they should be made to pay the SA. Here's one solution that would solve the problem, Require the SS's carry a bond (after all they are collecting escrowed money from the TC) and when they don't pay up we can file and collect from the bonding company and let the bonding company go after them. Simular to what they require the builder's to carry to assure that they have paid all of the subcontractor's that they have hired.

Reply by sue_pa on 1/10/08 2:18pm
Msg #230015

bankruptcy curiosity

...due to the signing services went bankrupt...

In all my years I don't ever recall (although admittedly my memory has dimmed lately) a signing service going bankrupt. Bankruptcies I recall are First Plus Direct - a direct lender (all unsecured creditors have been paid by the trust, along with 8% interest) ; BridgeSpan (title company - not sure of the status of claims) and now Express (a title company and initially it doesn't look good for payment). Many of us can spit out a list of companies that went under (and the signs usually were there although not always) but bankruptcy and signing services ...

Reply by SueW/Tn on 1/10/08 2:30pm
Msg #230018

All Pro...got the "announcement" from his attorney n/m

Reply by rengel/CA on 1/10/08 2:14pm
Msg #230011

"Remember we are independent contractors, yes the companies are obligated to pay us, but with that we also take a risk."

Yeah, and let me try that tactic with the utility company, the tax assessor, my mortgage company, the local restaurant, etc, etc, etc, and see how far THAT gets me. I provide a service and need to be paid for that service. If I provide that service, I will be paid or I will take you to small claims court. Period. End of Story.
My .02

Reply by Les_CO on 1/10/08 2:41pm
Msg #230022


I agree/disagree with Chris. Want to or not, we DO take/share risks in this (Signing Agent) business, much more so than in any other service related business I can think of. I’m not going to go into ALL the myriad and convoluted reasons, but trust me, we MORE than share the hazards involved. If you don’t like it (I don’t) you can always demand payment in front. You may not get much business, but at least you eliminate the risks.

Reply by Bob_Chicago on 1/10/08 3:19pm
Msg #230042

Valid points on both sides of this issue.

Both an art and a science
Need to weigh risks based on many AND changing factors
Remember, you have a 100% chance of not being paid for the
assignment that you turn down because the think that there is
a " chance" that you will not be paid at all or not paid in full .
You don't want to be taken advantage of, but at a certain point,
you might be better chalking up a lost fee than spending hours to chase
a few bucks.
Running a business has both risks and rewards in terms of time, $$,
professionalism and maintaining a life.
You need to be able to balance and optimize these factors to maintain your
sanity and the sanity of those who are close to you.
One thing is always true. "And this too shall pass"

Reply by Bernard Kreilick on 1/11/08 8:30am
Msg #230189

Meeks is full of it. He/She is probably a signing service