Posted by RickinVA on 7/28/08 11:12am
Msg #257250

Mortgage Docs

Anyone have a problem with Mortgage Docs? I got a call Thursday for a Friday closing. Negotiated a fee and received the docs. Got them signed Friday and shipped them back. They called this AM and said they all but about 36 docs back. They said Title wants me to go back and get the missing docs resigned and notarized with Fridays date. (I also missed notarizing one title doc, which I would take care of, naturally.) I saw all the good comments on them and can't imagine why they would pull this on me. There wouldn't be any reason, unless the docs were really missing, but ALL the docs were in the package when I sent it. Comments?

Reply by desktopfull on 7/28/08 11:32am
Msg #257255

If they were email docs, compare the missing ones

to the package they emailed. If they made the mistake you should get paid for the second trip.

Reply by bhb/VA on 7/28/08 11:33am
Msg #257256

Possibly they had made errors in those docs? That's a lot of resigning! Don't you have the tracking number so you can trace to see if they received the documents? UPS/Fedex would note if their was a problem with the shipment.
Sounds fishy to me. I wouldn't backdate.

Reply by bhb/VA on 7/28/08 11:34am
Msg #257257

Oops. "there" not "their" n/m

Reply by Ilene C. Seidel on 7/28/08 11:35am
Msg #257258

If the docs were emailed to you you have a record of receipt. See how many pages you received. I would forward their package back to the one claiming a descrepency. Also double check the attachment make sure you printed all. You really don't have a leg to stand on if you want to get paid. This happened to me some months ago someone calling me screaming the owners aff was missing when I knew it was there. Low and behold it was there and they were so embarrased of their behavor they paid me more than I asked for. But don't hold your breath on that. Go fix the problem and be it a lesson

Reply by RickinVA on 7/28/08 11:54am
Msg #257262

The Docs were in the package when it was shipped. Fed Ex tracking shows delivered. Again, they say some were missing. I see no info indicating there was a problem with an opened package, but they were there when I shipped them. Don't know how to prove a negative, especially when they have the docs.

Reply by Prosperity on 7/28/08 12:04pm
Msg #257265

Do you keep a good notary journal? If so, you can probably prove that you completed those docs, which should make your argument a little stronger.

Reply by WDMD on 7/28/08 12:17pm
Msg #257269

"Do you keep a good notary journal? If so, you can probably prove that you completed those docs, which should make your argument a little stronger."

Rick said they received all but about 36 docs back. I know in my journal I do not list every non-notarized document in the package in my journal. If he had 36 notarized documents missing I hope he got paid well for the signing.

Reply by Rita Adu on 7/28/08 12:24pm
Msg #257273

"Rick said they received all but about 36 docs back. I know in my journal I do not list every non-notarized document in the package in my journal. If he had 36 notarized documents missing I hope he got paid well for the signing."

I read very carefully what Rick said. I'm suggesting that maybe if "ANY" of those 36 pages were to be notarized, and he can prove that they were (perhaps with verification from his journal), then maybe it with strengthen his argument that he had the other docs signed as well. It's just a thought. Do you have anything USEFUL to offer??

Reply by WDMD on 7/28/08 12:26pm
Msg #257276

"I'm suggesting that maybe if "ANY" of those 36 pages were to be notarized, and he can prove that they were (perhaps with verification from his journal), then maybe it with strengthen his argument that he had the other docs signed as well. It's just a thought. Do you have anything USEFUL to offer??"

How would him having proof of notarizing any documents in the package be useful in determining if he missed any documents or not?

Reply by Prosperity on 7/28/08 12:38pm
Msg #257278

"How would him having proof of notarizing any documents in the package be useful in determining if he missed any documents or not?"

I was specifically speaking about the 36 pages.

Rick, if you don't understand my suggestion, then I will be happy to discuss it with you.

Reply by WDMD on 7/28/08 12:44pm
Msg #257280


"I was specifically speaking about the 36 pages.

Rick, if you don't understand my suggestion, then I will be happy to discuss it with you. "


Not trying to give you a hard time. Just trying to understand how a journal could help me determine if say, the RESPA Servicing Disclosure was signed, or if the loan app was signed. I may run into this situation and if there is a way this could help determine if the docs were actually signed when the TC or SS says they are missing, I'd like to know how.

Reply by Lee/AR on 7/28/08 12:25pm
Msg #257274

So, what's the final shakeout on this?

Either they never sent them or they lost them. If edocs, you should be able to prove what was & wasn't in the pkg. IF you missed notarizing 1 Title doc, that seems to indicate that the TC docs were sent and, unless you're in the habit of munching on docs while driving, they got them & misplaced them.

Reply by desktopfull on 7/28/08 12:32pm
Msg #257277

You also might want to find if the package looked like it had been opened before they received it from the shipper. Had that happen once and the shipper lost some of the docs when it jammed their machine, they took what they noticed and put them in another envelope made a new shipping sticker (thankfully a preprinted one, mine was handwritten) and since the balance to the TC. Once we figured out what happened the TC filed a claim against UPS for my additional fees and shipping to get the missing docs signed.

Reply by JulieD/KS on 7/28/08 1:04pm
Msg #257284

I had this happen once, although with a different signing service. There were about that many pages ostensibly missing from the package I returned. I submit a thorough invoice to the signing service, and based on that thoroughness, the signing service was inclined to believe that I had sent all the docs and that the issue was at the title company.

On my invoice, I list the order number, the borrower name(s), time, date and day of signing, address and signing address (if different), tracking number and shipping company, name, address and phone number of lender and title companies, how many signatures were notarized and the name of each doc notarized and the number of signatures notarized on each individual doc. Also, if it's edocs, I put in the time the docs were promised to arrive, the time they actually arrived, and how many pages it was (vs. how many promised, if substantially different). If faxbacks, I list how many pages were said to need to be faxed vs. actual amount.

As it turns out, the title company had left 30-some pages on the scanner...and then screamed that the notary (me) had failed to return all the pages. The docs were eventually found and I was cleared.

But - because of my thorough invoice, the signing service was backing me all the way. They said it was the most thorough invoice they'd ever seen and they figured, anyone with that much thoroughness could not possibly misplace 30 pages of documents.

So, tell MDocs to have the title company check their scanner.
Julie in KS

Reply by Ernest__CT on 7/28/08 6:00pm
Msg #257364

Julie: You do that for _each signing_?!

How on Earth do you have enough time to do all those steps and record keeping for each signing?!r Things have slowed to a crawl for everybody, I know, but good grief! You're not making any money if you're spending the time necessary for that much record keeping.

Reply by RickinVA on 7/28/08 1:30pm
Msg #257287

Re: *Solved * Mortgage Docs

Situation solved, sort of. Docs were in 6 attachments D/L from their web site. Total size of the attachment in question was 97 pages. For some reason, only the first 60 pages printed. The others did not. I can't understand that, but I reprinted the package from page 61 and they printed. So neither Mortgage Docs nor the TC was to blame. Just me, but I don't know how. That's gonna take some investigation.

As for all the suggestions, I appreciate them. A journal would not have been helpful.

I am now gonna sneak off into the bushes and slit my wrists. Then, I'll have to figure a way to check printed docs against what I think is there.

Rick

Reply by JulieD/KS on 7/28/08 1:33pm
Msg #257288

Re: *Solved * Mortgage Docs

I had that happen once, also. They said they were sending some extra docs but I they failed to say they were attached to the email. In an AOL email, attachments aren't as glaringly obvious, and I missed about 30 pages of the package (the actual package came via Swiftview...so I assumed it was a complete package). I made the trip back on my own dime (naturally) and vowed to always verify if there is an attachment to an AOL email. Fortunately, I do most of 'doins' via yahoo these days.

Don't slit your wrists. We live and learn.

Reply by Linda Juenger on 7/28/08 1:57pm
Msg #257297

We're all human and will make mistakes. Not intentionally

as it costs us to correct them. Don't beat yourself up over this. As a rule, I check the last page of the attachment against what was printed. I feel confident then that all printed from #1 to the last page number. I too have missed an attachement completely. It happens and all we can do is get it done for the borrower and move on.

Reply by Maureen_nh on 7/28/08 1:55pm
Msg #257295

Re: *Solved * Mortgage Docs

I have had this happen a couple of times. My printer just quit before printing the whole pkg.
No reason that I could ever figure out except that it just got tired.
Fortunately I caught it,
I don't do it every time like I should, but I usually scroll down to the last page and make sure that it is there.
Now that I've said that, watch it happen to me and I miss it.

Reply by RickinVA on 7/28/08 2:15pm
Msg #257305

Re: *Solved * Mortgage Docs

Well, I bandaged my wrists but the one around my neck was a little tight. I *may* have figured it out. If the package of paper has been opened, the pages often will catch on the preceding page as (I think) the paper soaks up some moisture from the humidity around here, and the pages don't want to lay flat. I babysit the printer when I have a medium or larger package, and I was having that problem Friday. When the pages start to 'catch' on each other, I try to remove them from the catch tray. The printer is so fast that sometimes I take too long trying to straighten them. The stop button is right next to the catch tray, and I guess it's possible that I hit it in error without noticing it. Yes, I usually try to match the last page with the last one printed, but that doesn't always happen. Don't know if that is what happened, but I have no other ideas. Wish I could solve that curling problem, though. (Maybe a air tight paper safe, or something.
(Move to Arizona?)

Rick

Reply by LynnNC on 7/28/08 2:16pm
Msg #257306

Re: *Solved * Mortgage Docs

When I print docs, I always scroll to view the last document online and make sure it is the last document in the printed package. It is my way of making sure that I printed the entire package.

I began doing this when my printer ran out of paper once...I didn't realize it and didn't print the entire package. Luckily, I found out before I sent the package...I went back and had the borrowers sign the remaining docs.

Reply by thnotary_NY on 7/28/08 3:12pm
Msg #257332

If you haven't deleted the package, check the printers page count.

Reply by RickinVA on 7/28/08 3:17pm
Msg #257334

If you mean in the printer, I don't know how to do that. If you mean the attachment, it is correct.

Rick