Posted by Heather Prince on 7/31/08 2:45pm
Msg #257981

Non compete

Is this a usual part ofsigning up to do notary work for "broker" agencies? Even if you are contracted out?

TIA
Heather

Reply by Charles_Ca on 7/31/08 2:56pm
Msg #257983

Since all it takes to be a Signing Service is a telephone

they don't wnat precocious notaries competing. I don't sign aleatory or unilateral contracts and most Signing Service contracts are junk. I strike out what I don't like in contacts, intial the strikeout and sign the contract but I don't contract with Signing Services: have you gotten to the part regarding the confidentiality?? They want you to keep quiet when they don't pay or abuse you in other ways!

Reply by Loretta on 7/31/08 3:15pm
Msg #257990

Re: Since all it takes to be a Signing Service is a telephone

I never sign those things. I have been doing title work for 12 years and they are my competition. I should make them sign something saying that they will not work for my clients.

Reply by No/ta/ry/2u on 7/31/08 4:44pm
Msg #258016

Actually notaries should have SS to sign a contract that they (notary) will be paid on time.

Reply by ananotary on 7/31/08 9:17pm
Msg #258038

Non compete contracts are not enforcable in California as a general rule. I was an advertising rep for a huge advertising agency for many years. They all have you sign one but you cannot be stopped from making a living. I had one that had a clause that I was unable to work for a competing firm for three years after leaving. Yeah right! (after speaking to an attorney of course)

Reply by heathernc on 7/31/08 9:31pm
Msg #258039

This states a 2 year non compete agreement. While that's understandable if I'm getting a regular gig, my husband is a bit concerned with that. So, unfortunately, I will probably have to decline if they won't waive the non compete.

Reply by Hugh Nations Signing Agents of Austin on 7/31/08 9:56pm
Msg #258041

Courts uniformly judge non-compete agreements using a "reasonableness" yardstick; they do not want to see a person barred from earning a livelihood. As a rule of thumb, a non-compete agreement of six months or less is likely to be enforced. Anything above that is going to get the closest scrutiny. Also, I think most jurisdictions adopt the rule that if any part of a non-compete agreement falls, the entirety falls.

You should, though, rather than relying on advice on this forum, talk with an attorney. See if your community has a bar-sponsored group that offers low-cost initial consultations.

Reply by jba/fl on 7/31/08 10:16pm
Msg #258044

From Wikipedia, googled: non-compete agreements:

Conversely, a business might abuse a non-compete covenant to prevent an employee from working elsewhere at all. Most jurisdictions in which such contracts have been examined by the courts have deemed CNCs to be legally binding so long as the clause contains reasonable limitations as to the geographical area and time period in which an employee of a company may not compete. Courts have held that, as a matter of public policy, an individual cannot be barred from carrying out a trade in which he has been trained except to the extent that is necessary to protect the employer.

[edit] Reasonable restriction on employee's ability to earn a living
Second, to enforce the CNC, a Plaintiff must show that it is not unduly harsh or oppressive in restricting the employee's ability to earn a living. In Virginia, a CNC is not unduly harsh or oppressive if balancing its function, geographic scope and duration the employee is not precluded from (1) working in a capacity not in competition with the employer within the restricted area or (2) providing similar services outside the restricted area. See Paramount, 380 S.E.2d at 925.

Business Week article answers to a question: http://www.businessweek.com/smallbiz/0005/sa000502.htm

: Employers use "covenants not to compete" to protect their competitive positions. They may restrict employees from working for a competitor or disclosing confidential information once they leave. Overly broad covenants -- such as those that try to restrict employees from working for any competitor, anywhere in the country, for more than a year -- seldom stand up in court because they unfairly deprive employees of their ability to earn a living. Likewise, if a noncompetition agreement smacks of punishing someone for leaving a job, courts are likely to strike it down.

To be enforceable, an employer must show that the agreement protects a legitimate business interest, imposes reasonable time and geographic limitations, does not unduly restrict the employee from earning a living, and is supported by "consideration." That is, the employer must give the employee something in exchange.

"Usually the consideration is the job itself," says Phillip Trobaugh, (etc.)

*******
I think you can get the drift. Someone else said strike through verbage you do not agree with, initial and return. I just sign them, knowing reasonably, that they can do nothing to restrict my activities. Most of these are employer/employee relations, and we are not really employees, rather contract labor, which by its very definition means we work for whoever hires us, and they already know this.

I have other issues with these contracts they ask us to sign, and I could be wrong, but I feel that since they never sign the contract it is therefore of little consequence as it is not complete., esp. since I may line through and initial and they have not legally recognized this or these change(s). I am not an attorney, nor have I ever desired to be one or played one in a play, movie or on TV, so this is only my opinion, mine alone. It may be wrong legally too, it is untested in court.

Reply by jba/fl on 7/31/08 10:23pm
Msg #258047

from: http://library.findlaw.com/1999/Aug/1/128482.html (google is your friend)


Q. My employer required me to sign an agreement saying that I will not take a job with a competitor for two years after leaving the company. Am I really restricted from working for a competing company? How can I be restricted from working in my field of specialty?

A. In general, covenants not to compete (also called noncompete agreements) are disfavored because of the inherent restrictions such agreements place on the ability of employees to change jobs. However, under North Carolina law, these agreements may be enforceable if certain conditions are met. The first is that the agreement must be entered into to protect a legitimate business interest of the employer. The employer's desire to limit competition is not a legitimate purpose -- the employer has no right to restrict reemployment based solely on a desire to limit competition. However, if the employer has another business reason (such as an investment of special training or the disclosure to the employee of proprietary information), the noncompete agreement may be enforceable if the other conditions of enforceability are met.

Reply by SharonMN on 8/1/08 10:35am
Msg #258125

If they are asking me not to solicit their clients for business, I usually X out their language and say something like "I cannot agree to this provision without having a complete list of your clients, as I may already work for some of them." If I feel like the new relationship is worth it, I might offer up "I agree not to solicit any clients I learn about as a result of working with you."

If they are asking you not to *work* for any other signing services or title companies, that's a little odd unless you are an employee and I wouldn't agree to it as an independent contractor. Sort of like telling your roofer, "You can't fix anybody else's roof but mine."

Reply by sue_pa on 8/1/08 7:15am
Msg #258088

is your husband a lawyer?

You are a BUSINESS. Why in the world what your husband thinks is of any concern is beyond me. Businesss owners don't base business decisions on their spouse's 'concerns' regarding legal issues. They contact an attorney.

While none of us know what is in the contract you are looking at, there are several clauses included in most signing service contracts that would be of greater concern to me than a noncompete clause.

No offense Heather but it appears you will be one of the ones who say ... I've got no work ... if you run your business per this example.