Posted by JustANotary on 11/12/08 11:44am
Msg #269524

Requesting a copy of notary's journal entry (California)

I am trying to help an elderly lady I did a signing with. She has a lien against her property. The title company included the paper work that was filed with the county making this lien. The signature does not look like her signature & she says that there was a loan officer that came to her house, but there was no notary present & she did not sign a notary book. She is sharp & remembers all transactions & has most paper work in her files. This lender is trying to charge her for brokers fees even though she did not go through with the loan! Many thousands of dollars!

Could someone tell me, where is the code that shows the notary must produce a copy of the notary section to someone that asks. Also, this is from some time ago, so if the notary no longer has the notary journals, next I would ask the county for a copy, correct? Also, if I remember correctly, the notary is able to ask for $2 for the copy charges, is that right? Can a lender charge thousands of dollars for broker fees for a loan the borrower decides against? I figured they were limited to appraisal & credit report etc.

It looks like this is elder abuse, I really appreciate your help on this!

Reply by Linda_H/FL on 11/12/08 11:55am
Msg #269526

Page 12 of your handbook

"A notary public must respond within 15 business days after the receipt of a written request
from any member of the public for a copy of a transaction in the notary public journal by
supplying either a photostatic copy of a line item from the notary public’s journal or an
acknowledgment that no such line item exists. The written request shall include the name of
the parties, the type of document, and the month and year in which the document was notarized.
The cost to provide the requested information must not exceed thirty cents ($0.30) per page.
(Government Code sections 8206(c) and 8206.5)"

Reply by davidK/CA on 11/12/08 12:17pm
Msg #269529

CA Notary Hanbook link

http://www.sos.ca.gov/business/notary/notary_hdbk.htm

Go there and print out your own personal copy of the handbook, read it, study it as if your financial future depends on it (IT DOES!) and carry it with you whenever you go to a signing or do general notary work. That way you will know the answers to questions of procedure, or at least know where to look for the answer...in your own briefcase. It's your lifeline.

Reply by Calnotary on 11/12/08 12:59pm
Msg #269536

"JustANotary"? And you call yourself a Notary? n/m

Reply by Kevin Ledbetter on 11/12/08 1:12pm
Msg #269538

Re: "JustANotary"? And you call yourself a Notary?

I am surprised at your reply, I am taking time to help an elder I think was financially abused. Having a copy of the handbook in my case is a good idea though, I will do that.

Reply by Calnotary on 11/12/08 1:25pm
Msg #269539

Re: "JustANotary"? And you call yourself a Notary?

I am sorry for my reply Kevin, but that info you were requesting is something you are supposed to know if you are a CA Notary. Basic questions does not supposed to need for reading your CA notary handbook.

Reply by JustANotary on 11/12/08 1:33pm
Msg #269541

Lenders charging thousands for a cancled loan?

That was the other part of my question, has anyone heard of a mortgage company billing a customer many thousands of dollars for a loan that they do not go through with? I have only heard of them recovering actual costs such as appraisal & credit report. This lien was for them to pay the mortgage company for broker fees because the borrower decided not to go through with the loan process.

Reply by Scamp/AZ on 11/12/08 1:28pm
Msg #269540

Re: "JustANotary"? And you call yourself a Notary?

Where on earth did "just a notary" appear in the post. I read it three times. I do not see why a snide comment like that is necessary.

Reply by jba/fl on 11/12/08 1:36pm
Msg #269542

Re: "JustANotary"? Not said, posting name Scamp,, n/m

Reply by Linda_H/FL on 11/12/08 1:50pm
Msg #269545

Question...

"She is sharp & remembers all transactions & has most paper work in her files."

In CA, doesn't the homeowner/property owner have to be notified via certified mail or service of process or some other suitable means that a lien is being placed on their property for whatever reason and then be given an opportunity to rectify the matter? Also, is she sure she didn't sign something at the inception of the loan process that if she canceled she'd be responsible for certain fees to the broker?

Personally, I think you should maybe refer her to a good local attorney and step back. You are, after all, "JustANotary".... MHO

Reply by JustANotary on 11/12/08 1:59pm
Msg #269547

Re: Question...

She is sure she did not sign anything saying that, she is sure she was not sent a notice of a lien, the lien was recorded & sent back to the lender. She did meet with a mortgage broker but is sure that there was no notary present. I like to help people when I can, if there is no journal entry showing that this was properly notarized, then it should be pretty easy to fight this.

Reply by Linda_H/FL on 11/12/08 2:01pm
Msg #269548

Like I said - she needs an attorney... n/m

Reply by Marian_in_CA on 11/12/08 2:55pm
Msg #269556

Yup, this is clearly the job of a lawyer. n/m

Reply by Sylvia_FL on 11/12/08 3:17pm
Msg #269560

Re: Question...

While I agree it is nice to help people when you can, it is not wise to step put yourself in a UPL situation. Refer the lady to an elder abuse specialist, or to an attorney or both.

Reply by Marian_in_CA on 11/12/08 2:31pm
Msg #269551

Well, if you're a notary you should already know the answer to this and it should be second nature. While it could be elder abuse, more importantly what you describe could be outright fraud.

I assume you have a copy of the notarized documents, so you have the name and county of the notary? If so, contact the county clerk and find out if the notary is still commissioned. If not, you can request the line entry from the clerk provided the notary turned in his/her journals as required by law. If the notary is still commissioned, get his/her business address from the clerk and send your request as detailed in the notary handbook already quoted here.

The notary is required to respond within 15 days or suffer serious consequences.

How long ago did this happen? Clerks will only keep journals for 10 years before they destroy them.

Reply by sue_pa on 11/12/08 3:51pm
Msg #269564

#1 - this is none of your business. As others have said, refer her to an attorney or to some type social agency. You have NO idea what is and what is not elder abuse in this situation - you know one side of a story when there are 3 sides.

#2 - I'd almost guarantee she signed something saying she'd pay. I do a reverse application that has the language about paying for the title search, appraisal, etc., at the bottom of a page where it seems to make no sense - can't remember what it is, perhaps a name type affidavit.

Reply by Terri_CA on 11/13/08 2:45pm
Msg #269615

The smart thing to do is to refer her to a real estate attorney (i.e., because of the lien); you could offer the attorney assistance with the notary laws, if they are not familiar. It sounds as if you are assisting this elderly person as a good Samaritan and trying to provide notary information. There's nothing wrong with that, but they should still have an attorney's advice.

Curious to me is that usually the County Recorder (at least in LA County) will send copies of recorded documents (such as the lien) to the owner of record, even if the documents are to be sent to another place.

I can make all kinds of suppositions, but only her attorney should provide advice. Good Luck.