Posted by Louis/AZ on 12/7/09 7:11pm
Msg #313392

Notary Rotary Search Limits?

So I decided to check out the competition in my area and I punched in a bunch of zip codes. After the 5th or so one, I got a message stating that my search limit was exceeded. I just researched this policy with the orange button, and I have to say I am VERY disappointed with NR. I've read the arguments in favor of these search limits: it helps prevent the pilfering of notary data and prevents signing companies from uploading info to their own databases. I've also read the statement from the NR owners saying that Title and Signing Companies can just have their profiles registered as TC or SS to get unlimited searches.

First of all, not every Title Company is going to bother establishing an account with Notary Rotary, and if they run into the same block that I did, I'm concerned that they will just stop using NR. Other directories, one in particular which seems to attract a lot more business for me, do not have any such search restrictions. Already only 7% of my website-referred signing calls come from Notary Rotary, (I ask everyone how they found me) and I wonder if these search restrictions might be a contributing factor. As for the pilfering of data and spam, I have my e-mail on several directories and I maybe get 2-3 spam e-mails per day. It's a little annoying, but it just comes with the territory when you have your e-mail address published online.

As a paying Notary Rotary subscriber, I have to say I am very shocked and disappointed by this policy. I realized it's not an extraordinarily high premium to pay for premier membership, but a signing agent website should not in any way make it difficult for their members' profiles to be searched. I will definitely take this into consideration when it comes time to renew. Just my opinion.

Reply by Michelle/AL on 12/7/09 7:54pm
Msg #313401

Louis, I'm a premier member and I can check more than

five profiles. I'm not sure what the cap it but I think it's around 10-20. Only twice in three years did this prove to be a problem for me.

I'd be interested in hearing from a scheduler from a Title or Signing Co. to see if they agree with your concerns. To be honest, I don't know if they keep their own list of notaries, or if they log on to view our profiles each time they have a closing.

I think you have a reasonable argument for possibly increasing the number of times a person can view profiles in a given 24 hour period. Let's see what others have to say.

Reply by Joan Bergstrom on 12/8/09 12:49am
Msg #313422

Re: Louis, I'm a premier member and I can check more than

I don't think limiting the number of views of profile(s) is a good marketing idea for any notary listed on this website. Duh!

Reply by PAW on 12/8/09 7:08am
Msg #313428

Re: Louis, I'm a premier member and I can check more than

I support Harry's decision to limit the number of searches, especially if the 'user' isn't logged on. I know of a signing agent who attempted to start their own signing service. To preload their database, they continually did multiple searches, extracting the data from other companies (including NotRot) databases. IMO, this is nothing more than theft and should be dealt with. As a precautionary measure, limiting the number of successive searches inhibits this type of activity and as a result, protects the membership.

Reply by Michelle/AL on 12/8/09 9:15am
Msg #313451

I guess I'll come clean and confess.

The last time I was searching a lage number of notary profiles was in September '09 when I wanted to email Alabama notaries about the Oct SOS Notary Conference and tell them about the bus ride. I obtained email addresses from sites like NotRot. If anyone minded they didn't tell me. I did feel a little guilty but I wasn't selling anything other than a seat on a bus to a notary meeting.

Limiting the # of profiles I could view at one time slowed me down. Instead of getting it done at one sitting. It took three days.

My guess is that if Harry doesn't place a cap on the # of views on any given day, our spam mail would probably increase (for those of us who don't have spam filters).

Reply by Louis/AZ on 12/8/09 11:13am
Msg #313477

Re: I guess I'll come clean and confess.

Uhn uhn, this isn't making any sense. If a signing company REALLY wanted to "steal" massive amounts of data, then they could just create their own SS profile and then take advantage of the unlimited searches, and then "steal" all the data they want, right? So having this limit on searches just forces a SS to create a profile before "stealing" a notary's information. Secondly, wouldn't signing agents want their information taken down by as many signing services as possible? (Assuming they're okay with the typically lower fees paid by signing services). As for Michelle's point, I think she's making it for me. She used the search for what was arguably a non-signing related purpose. In a sense, she was still able to "steal" other notaries' information. All it did was slow her down. Now, I don't believe Michelle did anything wrong, but it illustrates the ineffectiveness of this so-called "search limit policy."

I should clarify that I was not logged in when I did my zip code searches, but I'm telling you it definitely was no more than 7 when I was kicked out. That means any Title Company without a NR profile gets kicked out somewhere around 5-7 searches. What concerns me is this: people tend to be lazy by nature. Now, signing services definitely have the time to sit around and create NR profiles because they don't do any actual work. But Title Companies, the créme de la créme type of clientele, are busy on the phone with lenders, county recorders, borrowers, real estate agents, and they're also busy doing title searches and filling out various other paperwork. If a new title company finds NR and then comes across this "search limit" roadblock, they may not take the time to create a profile and share the log-in info with all their employees. They'll just move on to another notary directory. I suppose if you have a good profile on "another" directory, as I do, then maybe this NR thing won't matter too much in the end, but I think NR is shooting itself and its members in the foot by imposing any restrictions on the searches of members listed in a PUBLIC directory. The point of being listed is to be seen. Spam and the occasional cruddy telemarketing calls just come with the territory.

Well, since no else seems to feel strongly about this, I guess Joan and I are out on a limb by ourselves on this issue. (*waves hi to Joan*). NR just lost points with me.

Reply by PAW on 12/8/09 12:29pm
Msg #313489

Re: I guess I'll come clean and confess.

A service, be it a signing service or even a title company, just starting out, certainly doesn't want their contact information available when the pilfer the database. It's too easy to "see" them. Unregistered, not logged in users think they are working in a stealth environment while they steal the information. It doesn't work that way. It can be tracked and action taken, but the amount of time and effort to do so is somewhat prohibitive. The limit will only effect those who want to cheat and steal.

The title companies I've talked with, have not indicated that they ran into a roadblock while attempt to search for a signing agent. Granted, I did not do a widespread survey nor did I specifically ask if they had troubles finding agents for closings.

Actually, in my last calculation of where I should spend my advertising dollars when it comes to searches for signing agents, Google and my website have risen to the top of the list. Not to say that some calls say they found me on NotRot, or someplace else, but more have said they simply do a Google search (such as "Signing Agent" somecity somestate). My website almost always appears on the first page, near or at the top. So, I invest more time and money in search engines than I do in notary databases.

I do have a premier membership here and at other sites, not only for the listing, but because there is value added in the forums and discussion groups offered by those sites.

Reply by Louis/AZ on 12/8/09 11:17am
Msg #313479

And what's up with FREE listings?

Why is NR offering free listings? If you can't afford the $75 per year to be listed, you're not a serious signing agent, I'm sorry. I don't know about people in less-populated areas, but there are more than enough premier members in my area without freebie leaches clogging up the page. FREE listings? That's some business model.

"Giving everyone something for nothing is called what, class? Communism!"

Reply by Linda_H/FL on 12/8/09 11:24am
Msg #313480

Louis, keep one thing in mind

"is NR offering free listings? If you can't afford the $75 per year to be listed, you're not a serious signing agent"

Everyone listed isn't necessarily a signing agent - notaries who do strictly general notary work are listed too.

Reply by LKT/CA on 12/8/09 12:51pm
Msg #313494

Re: And what's up with FREE listings?

<<<If you can't afford the $75 per year to be listed, you're not a serious signing agent, I'm sorry.>>>

One price does not fit all for a premier membership. It would cost me $139 for a premiere membership for the year - not sure why there is no uniform fee. I see an new option of paying monthly - at $19 per month. That equals $228 a year if I choose the monthly payment option.

Reply by Notarysigner on 12/8/09 1:44pm
Msg #313502

Re: And what's up with FREE listings?

"Other directories, one in particular which seems to attract a lot more business for me, do not have any such search restrictions."......

I believe those "other" services allow you to advertise in as many areas as you can afford to pay for. Not Rot, no comparison. Big bucks rule there. I called a couple of them and they are people acting as SS themselves. Maybe a compromise, free listings for basic members.

What is the reason so many people have their profiles blocked anyway? Could it be because they don't want their info to show up in somebody's database without their permission?

Reply by JanetK_CA on 12/8/09 2:14pm
Msg #313512

Re: And what's up with FREE listings?

When you are talking about "profiles blocked" do you mean profiles not linked to posts? If so, I think you may be confusing apples and oranges. (Please straighten me out, if I'm wrong.) I choose not to link my profile because I don't want the info on number of views to be filled with other notaries from this forum just checking out profiles -- although lately it seems that that is all I'm getting anyway... But anyone doing a search to "Find a Notary" in my area still gets access to my profile. I still seem to end up in many data bases, but this isn't the only site where I advertise.

Am I missing something? Is there a feature that lets you block viewing of your profile altogether? If that's the case, I don't see why someone would bother having a profile if they didn't want it to be viewed. Like Louis said, that's what it's all about.

Reply by Notarysigner on 12/8/09 3:25pm
Msg #313525

Re: And what's up with FREE listings?

It says, "Hide my profile from searches"

Reply by Louis/AZ on 12/8/09 3:43pm
Msg #313526

Exposure

If you're asking me why I don't link to my profile when posting, Janet brought up a good reason I didn't even think of: not wanting my profile hits to reflect people just checking me out on the discussion board. The main reason why I don't link from the discussion board is because my profile contains wording targeted toward general notary clientele for certain notary-related things. There is a limited need for these other "things" and I don't want other notaries in my area to be aware of these or to steal my wording. Granted, any local notary can search my zip code and view my profile, but the discussion board is read by hundreds (maybe thousands?) of notaries across the country and I don't want to broadcast my business secrets across the U.S.

As for "hiding profile from searches," I have never used that feature. If it means that your profile doesn't come up when searching for a notary, then I have no idea why any notary advertising here would use that option - unless maybe they were going on a vacation or something and didn't want to be bothered with calls?

It just seems totally counter-intuitive to limit the number of searches based on this flawed rationale that you're protecting your members. Yeah. You're potentially "protecting" them from earning more money. I think I've already talked these points to death. It's obvious my complaints are not going to result in a change in NR policy. Oh well....

Reply by Notarysigner on 12/8/09 4:19pm
Msg #313537

Re: Exposure pls Louis....

I was answering Janet's question, where....There's a box when you open your profile that allows you to hide your profile. I believe your profile is available to members but you can hide it from non-members..should you choose to do say. It is not any of my business what anybody does when where how or why. I don't have any problems with what you are saying...

Reply by BrendaTx on 12/8/09 6:38pm
Msg #313556

The only time I'm irritated with Free listings

is when the people are critical of others who help them and they whine using their free listing.

Also, when people have multiple listings because they are greedy slobs, and when SSs are allowed to have a free listing because no one is culling the database--those things irritate me.

The truth is that if there weren't free listings then the database could not boast as many listings because some will not pay a penny to advertise. The database would shrink and then seekers would look elsewhere.

I financially support this site because it has been very good to me financially and I enjoy the socializing. Having a paid listing makes it easier for me to search the site for info.

Reply by JanetK_CA on 12/9/09 1:22am
Msg #313592

Re: And what's up with FREE listings?

Thanks for the clarification. I guess I never paid attention to that for the very reason this thread was started. It does seem counter-intuitive, as Louis said. I think he makes some very good points.