Posted by BrendaTx on 12/9/09 7:01pm
Msg #313763

So, would you call this "notary presentment"?

I received the following email today. I declined to assist, but do you who care to parse through this letter believe this to be what is called notary presentment? It's a pretty good outline of the expectations of the client. I see their point, but don't care to get into that.

========


I am looking for a notary public to serve in the capacity of a notary
witness.

The job would be for the notary public to send documents to a specified
recipient and provide an affidavit of service after the delivery was
confirmed. The documents can be served by FedEX or UPS. A FedEx or UPS
account number will be provided. The documents to be served are
certified copies of an affidavit which was recorded in a county
recorders office.

The conformation of delivery would be included in the affidavit of
service. Of course, the affidavit of service would require the notary
witness to sign the affidavit in front of a notary. A bank notary is
certainly adequate.

After 30 days, if no response was received, on the 31st day, the notary
witness would sign an affidavit of non-response in front of a notary.
Though it is unlikely a response would be received, if a response was
received, the response would be in the form of documents delivered by
registered or certified mail or by FedEx or UPS or some similar service.
If any documents were received, they are to be sent to me. Scan the
document into a computer and send it by email to me. The originals would
be sent to my mailing address. Of course, if a response was received,
the the notary witness would provide an affidavit of response instead of
an affidavit of non-response.

I would sign a brief contract with the notary, stating what was to be
done and what was not done, which would state that the notary witness
was being contracted with to provide specific service and was not a
party to any document being served and had no interest in the documents
being served.

The affidavits would be supplied to the notary witness as would the
documents to be served.

Since both FedEx and UPS does package pick-up, serving the documents can
be done without leaving home for anyone who works out of a home office.
Of course, they would have to have in an area where FedEx/UPS does pick-up.

Does this interest you?

Best regards,

Reply by Claudine Osborne on 12/9/09 7:28pm
Msg #313766

I would need to know the fee that would be offered for this and about how many they want done. I would say this is general notary work but with a little more work involved.

Reply by BrendaTx on 12/9/09 7:48pm
Msg #313771

It does not sound like general notary work to me at all.

To me, general notary work is when I observe a signer execute a document(s) or acknowledge that they executed...not do a bunch of document shuffling for them and then go to another notary to have my own signature notarized. Sounds to me nothing at all like general notary work.

Reply by taxpro on 12/9/09 7:55pm
Msg #313774

Re: It does not sound like general notary work to me at all.

No it doesn't sound like notary work at all. It sounds like something anyone could do. In fact, why couldn't the guy just do it himself? The notary isn't notarizing anything, but actually would need to get her/his signature notarized by someone else.

Reply by BrendaTx on 12/9/09 8:12pm
Msg #313780

Re: It does not sound like general notary work to me at all.

*In fact, why couldn't the guy just do it himself?*

Exactly...that's why I made that quantum leap to thinking this was Notary Presentment...the notary is acting as a third party agent...which is...really...what attorneys do for people who hire them in addition to giving advice.

Reply by Claudine Osborne on 12/9/09 7:28pm
Msg #313767

I would need to know the fee that would be offered for this and about how many they want done. I would say this is general notary work but with a little more work involved.

Reply by John_NorCal on 12/9/09 7:42pm
Msg #313769

Sounds to me, IMHO, that this is a modern take on what notary presentment was originally intended to be. Not sure about TX but I don't think this would fly in CA.
I wouldn't want to be involved with this either, not as a notary public (witness?) anyway.

Reply by Roger_OH on 12/9/09 7:44pm
Msg #313770

PAW, does this sound like that guy that called us? n/m

Reply by PAW on 12/9/09 8:05pm
Msg #313776

I don't think so Roger. But certainly could be.

A different approach than what 'we' discussed, er ... what 'he' pontificated.

Reply by desktopfull on 12/9/09 8:06pm
Msg #313777

This sounds like process serving via Fed Ex or UPS.

Sounds like they are attempting to bypass normal civil process. I would be leary about doing this without a lot of addtitional information.

Reply by BrendaTx on 12/9/09 8:09pm
Msg #313778

Definitely do not want any part of it.

Hope I made myself clear on that!

Reply by CopperheadVA on 12/9/09 8:11pm
Msg #313779

I received an email request very similar to this recently - I declined as it just sounded way too involved for the piddly notary fee we can charge in VA. Plus, I'm not even sure it's an authorized notarial act (not addressed in the VA notary handbook) so I simply said no to the guy.

Reply by Susan Fischer on 12/9/09 8:14pm
Msg #313783

Agree with posters. Why not just use a proper process

server?

Reply by Claudine Osborne on 12/9/09 8:36pm
Msg #313790

Re: I was wrong!

Please forgive me I was wrong..I just reread Brendas post and I misunderstood..Please ignore my post..

Reply by Stamper_WI on 12/9/09 9:12pm
Msg #313795

JojoMn had a request like this from a local woman. If I remeber it right, the woman was working on getting out of paying her mortgage. Got the idea from a seminar.

Reply by Linda_H/FL on 12/9/09 9:16pm
Msg #313796

The guy who approached me about it a couple years ago

said it was effective for unjustified taxes...

Ugh

Reply by Doris_CO on 12/9/09 10:27pm
Msg #313803

Brenda, I had a call about this back in 2008. I asked a similar question as you here on NR. See message 251670. By the way, the web site referred by Nomad no longer exists. I also decided not to get involved.

Reply by jba/fl on 12/9/09 11:21pm
Msg #313804

Notary Acceptor is the term I think

See message #304420 & 304424.

I will never forget this beautiful trip on the river with this guy yammering away about how notaries could do.....(had to really work at tuning him out!)

Reply by BrendaTx on 12/10/09 6:30am
Msg #313814

Whether Notary Presentment or Acceptor, not difficult

or complicated as some experts on the subject have indicated. Nonetheless, rather than get involved with this kind of notary activity which some apparently do, I suggest that notaries who need more income avoid this kind of gimmicky stuff and opt for employment or other endeavors.

There's nothing wrong with working at a JOB while running one's business part-time until things turn around and the notary business can support itself. But that's just ol' practical me who does exactly that.

Reply by MW/VA on 12/10/09 7:34am
Msg #313819

Re: Whether Notary Presentment or Acceptor, not difficult

Great advice, Brenda. There are a lot of scams & gimmicks floating around and those desperate for work might be tempted to get involved.

Reply by Linda_H/FL on 12/10/09 10:39am
Msg #313831

I find myself distancing myself from anything

that is going to (a) put me between the debtor and the creditor; or (b) having my name associated with something questionable that more than likely is going to end up in litigation.

For the most part, notaries are not to be concerned with the "content of the documents" - unfortunately, in these situations, we smack dab in the middle of it and the content is very much our concern...and I just don't want any part of that.

MHO

Reply by Linda_H/FL on 12/10/09 10:40am
Msg #313832

Sorry, not "we smack dab" but "we're..."...:) n/m

Reply by jba/fl on 12/11/09 11:39am
Msg #313998

Did you see Robert/FL's response to this thread?

Didn't he just reverse himself from days of yore? Or was he just asking earlier? Anyway - it appears he has gained some maturity this past year. He sounds soooo different!

Reply by jba/fl on 12/11/09 11:41am
Msg #313999

Re: Did you see Robert/FL's response to this thread?

Well, I thought this was a PM to someone - but now it is public. I thoroughly stand by this comment though.

Reply by jojo_MN on 12/10/09 9:54am
Msg #313824

Please read my experience Message #304420. May be the same. n/m

Reply by Kathy Fletcher on 12/10/09 10:29am
Msg #313829

Arizona SOS states not a legal act in our state.

I received this same request a while back. Checked with my legal advisor and was told that notaries in Arizona are prohibited from certifying that we mailed anything. While it is not addressed in the notarial manual or statutes, it is NOT listed as an authorized act we can perform.

This would indeed be considered notary presentment and my legal advisor told me that this act can only be performed by a notary employee of a corporation. It is a very complicated duty to perform and requires specialized training. The SOS recently told at their workshop that notary presentation is not an act we can perform.

So I would recommend you check your laws in your particular state. I do hope this helps you Brenda.

Reply by BrendaTx on 12/11/09 4:36pm
Msg #314040

Thanks, Kathy - I never intended to do it.

It's a bunch of foolishness. Just trying to see if that's what it was called.

Reply by Robert/FL on 12/11/09 11:06am
Msg #313991

I don't believe this is authorized in any state

and if it is, it shouldn't be. This is a completely fraudulent method to avoid paying a debt, involving loony tax evaders who have twisted the Uniform Commercial Code to infer that a "negotiable instrument" includes written correspondence or demands for records or responses, and that failure of a government agency to respond to that instrument constitutes dishonor. This is completely absurd, because the UCC is very clear as to what is and isn't a "negotiable instrument".

Bottom line is - a negotiable instrument is, for all practical purposes, either a check or a promissory note. When somebody refuses to give payment on a check or promissory note, either due to insufficient funds in the account or whatever, that's called "dishonor". A "protest" is a certificate issued by a notary stating that dishonor occurred. It has the same legal proof of dishonor as a check that is stamped "NSF". These tax loonies seem to think that notaries are officers of the court or administrative judges, and that a "protest" is some type of administrative judgment. I have reviewed court cases, in Florida as well as other states, where these types of "protests" have been thrown out, and in some cases, reported to the notary public administrator in the state where the notary is commissioned.

If the states would actually EXPLAIN protests to notaries, then naive notaries wouldn't be tempted to get involved in this fraudulent "presentment" activity thinking that it's a legitimate duty. Even in states where the UCC has been adopted, some SOS do not allow notaries to do protests.

Reply by BrendaTx on 12/11/09 4:27pm
Msg #314039

Thanks, Robert. We've a notary or 2 who kinda make it

sound like this is okay, and a good business. But, I agree with you. It is not okay.

It's using any means possible to attempt to defraud creditors. I just can't respect that. If you can't pay, do what others do...deal with the calls, work out a plan, or file bankruptcy....don't play a little notary game and make the notary look like as big of a nutjob as you are.