Posted by brass/LA on 7/28/09 9:52am
Msg #297643

Borrower's initialing pages of Note & Mortgage - Louisiana

As a matter of practice, I have the borrowers initial each page of the Note and Mortgage documents that do not require a signature. I do this whether or not there are "initial ____" spaces on the documents. I also have the borrowers initial any non-signature pages of the HUD.

I do this to ensure that the borrowers and any other interested parties are able to identify all pages of the document that was signed and prevent other pages from being inserted into the document after the borrower signs.

I have never had a title company question this practice. Recently I received instructions in a confirmation email that stated that no documents were to be initialed unless (1) the borrowers were initialing a correction, or (2) the borrowers were initialing a specific initial line.

I followed the title companies instructions and updated the order with the info that I had followed all of their instructions regarding initialing of documents.

I'd like to hear from some other signing agents regarding their practice regarding initialing documents when there is no specific space provided for the initials.

Reply by MW/VA on 7/28/09 9:56am
Msg #297648

I always have them initial every page of the Note & DOT.

Reply by LynnNC on 7/28/09 9:57am
Msg #297649

I always have borrowers initial each page of the Note, but only initial the DOT and Riders if there are lines.

Reply by titleme2nc on 7/28/09 10:10am
Msg #297656

I do as you and have BO initial all money pages. This even saved a BO one time, who called us complaining that the #s did not match what his copy had said when the loan funded. We simply told him to ask for a copy of the HUD to be faxed to him. When he received it, there was no initial on one of the HUD pages. So he was able to prove & fight it, because of our initialing practice and won.

The company that you are working with, just might be the one who did his loan.. lol

Good luck.
T2

Reply by PAW on 7/28/09 9:59am
Msg #297650

If a document does not call for initials, then I do not instruct the signers to initial the document. As a mortgage broker, there are some lenders that are very picky about their documents and do not allow any unauthorized marks to be made. Some even go as far as not allowing corrections of any kind to be made. If a document needs to be corrected, a new document will be created.

IMO, never assume to do anything you aren't instructed to do. And lack of instruction doesn't mean you can.

Reply by Linda Juenger on 7/28/09 10:10am
Msg #297657

I ONLY have them initial when there are lines for them or unless instructed to do so. It is not up to US to make those decisons. You are "assuming" this is what they want and that is not our job.

Reply by Julie Williams on 7/28/09 10:09am
Msg #297655

You asked; here's my observation:

Your prevention of others pages being inserted is completely over the top, not your job and I would not hire you. Many here have delusions of grandeur and make notary rules based on what the notary feels the state legislatures' should hash out. A case of "Super Notary".

I recall that a Louisiana notary is way different than the other states, but I don't think the state gives you the right to tell title companies that DO issue final policy that you have decided that YOU want their clients to initial.

Reply by Jim/AL on 7/28/09 10:53am
Msg #297693

Agree with Paul, Linda and Julie. Follow instructions, easy n/m

Reply by MW/VA on 7/28/09 11:17am
Msg #297698

Re: Agree with Paul, Linda and Julie. Follow instructions, easy

Thanks for the discussion. I see the point. I was "taught" to initial all the pages, and have never had any kicked back. I think I need to adjust my procedures.

Reply by brass/LA on 7/28/09 10:47am
Msg #297688

Thanks to all who have responded. I really appreciate your feedback on this and will certainly take your input under consideration.

Initialing all of the pages on the note, HUD, and mortgage adds time to the closing (particularly when you get multiple HUD's, Mortgages, etc.

Thanks again!

Reply by jojo_MN on 7/28/09 11:23am
Msg #297702

When I first started this business, I always had them initial all pages. I've had a few TCs complain around five years ago, so I no longer initial unless there is a line or specifically requesting it in closing instructions.

I totally agree that the note and all legals should be initialled, though.

Reply by PAW on 7/28/09 12:10pm
Msg #297718

Initials = security is a false premise

This is why it is so important to provide the borrowers with a true and exact copy of all the documents. If there is any question about the validity of a document, then it can be compared to the borrowers copy.

Initials can probably be forged easier than initials, but changing a copy to match a changed original is a horse of another color.

Reply by brass/LA on 7/28/09 12:15pm
Msg #297720

Re: Initials = security is a false premise

Excellent point!

Reply by jojo_MN on 7/28/09 12:32pm
Msg #297725

Very good point!!! n/m

Reply by nolanotary on 7/28/09 12:46pm
Msg #297726

I have borrower(s) initial every page of all critcal docs (Note, Mortgage, HUD, etc..) even if there is no initial blocks indicated. I have been doing that since day one and it's never been a problem with any title company yet.

Reply by brass/LA on 7/28/09 1:27pm
Msg #297731

Re: Borrower's initialing pages of Note & Mortgage - Louisia

I have never had a title company question the initialing of critical docs either. But I was advised in writing by a particular title company, on an email confirmation, NOT to have the borrowers initial any document that did not have an "initial ___". That just got me to consider whether or not initialing the critical docs was the correct and necessary way of doing my job. Based on some of the comments on this subject from some highly respected signing agents I am considering only having the borrowers initial documents that have a space for initials or where I am directed by the title company to do so.

Not being aware of any "legal requirement" that these critical document pages be initialed, and having seen Notes and Mortgage documents that have "initial spaces" and don't have "initial spaces", I think it would be prudent to just follow the instructions of the title company and lender. If the title company/lender wants the documents initialed they will either have a space indicated on the page or send written instructions.

Sometimes, after being in this business for some time we may lose sight of the fact that we don't make the rules!

Again, thanks to all for the input and discussion.

Reply by JanetLA on 7/28/09 2:39pm
Msg #297740

Not unless there is a line. My time is my money.

I do think people don't understand Louisiana notary duties. For example the fact that we can actually prepare wills, mortgages, and suggest and prepare any form a customer might need. We are different for sure, but I don't make extra work for myself. Have a great week to all.

Reply by JanetK_CA on 7/29/09 1:55am
Msg #297824

Re: Borrower's initialing pages of Note & Mortgage - Louisia

"I think it would be prudent to just follow the instructions of the title company and lender. If the title company/lender wants the documents initialed they will either have a space indicated on the page or send written instructions."

I think this pretty much says it all - and is prudent advice across the board, except for actual notarizations. In those cases, of course, we need to put our state's notary laws first.