Posted by parkerc/ME on 6/13/09 5:32pm
Msg #292267

Form I-9 and/or Employment Eligibility for TX

Just got an email request to "notarize" a Form I-9 for employment eligibility. I responded that the Form I-9 does not require (nor even provide for) notarization, just employee and employer completion when employee provides the required identifying documentation. Got the response back from that person that "It does require a notary if the people hiring you are in Texas and the require as a stipulation for employment." Am I missing something . . anyone in TX? This is obviously someone in ME who's applying for (or accepting) employment in TX.

Reply by parkerc/ME on 6/13/09 6:56pm
Msg #292269

Got my answer. Thanks anyway. n/m

Reply by MikeC/NY on 6/13/09 7:03pm
Msg #292270

Anyone can ask to have anything notarized... Just ask if they want an ack or a jurat, tell them it will be attached to the I-9, and go from there. If they don't know what they need, you obviously can't help them...

Had something similar happen a couple of years ago - friends insisting that they had to have a document notarized, but there was no notarial block on it and they didn't know what form they needed. I declined; they found a notary at a bank who stamped the document and signed it - no venue, no notarial block, just a stamp and a signature. I couldn't make them understand that what they had was useless, but they were happy that they got it done... I suspect they came away thinking I didn't know what I was talking about...

Reply by Marian_in_CA on 6/13/09 7:18pm
Msg #292272

I-9 Have recently changed in the last few months...

Well, I'm not in Texas... but this is a Federal form and a LOT of Federal forms fail to provide for a spot to notarize. Traditionally, the I-9 does not need to be notarized, no. But it doesn't mean that it CAN'T. This is especially true for people who are hired remotely.

It's not YOUR job as a notary to tell somebody what does and does not require a notarization. That's crossing the line in to UPL. If you've been asked to notarize a signature... you do it. As long as you do NOT sign the form as the person's employer... you're fine. Just notarize the signature of the employee in section 1, attach a loose cert and you're good.

HOWEVER... if they want you to sing the form as the person's employer, that's a bit different.

The only way you should complete section 2 is if the employer has contacted you directly and asked you to complete it as their representative. You should be compensated for them for this service and get the details of the job in writing for your records. In this case, you would not be completing the form as a notary, but as a representative of the employer.

A lot of employers ask Notaries to do this because they know that notaries are experienced with evaluating ID documents.

I complete I-9 forms ALL THE TIME... but never as a notary. I always do it as a representative of the employer. I have notarized two I-9 forms, though... on just section 1. These were both cases where the employer verified the Social and eligibility to work electronically and the employee was FedExing their ID document (from list B) to the employer for review. My job was to simply notarize the signature in part 1.

Reply by parkerc/ME on 6/13/09 10:44pm
Msg #292278

Re: I-9 Have recently changed in the last few months...

You're spot on, Marian. He wasn't very clear in his initial email, making it sound like it was something specific for TX. So they did what you were saying . . . his prospective employer sent me an email along with specifics authorizing me to be their representative to complete Section 2 (which I will keep for my records). BTW, the directions from the Department of Homeland Security only say that the form I-9 has to be signed by the employee and the employer (or their designated rep) . . . gives no instructions anywhere that it has to be notarized, so my telling him that the instructions for completing Form I-9 do not say to have it notarized is not UPL on my part - just relaying what DHS instructions say. Thanks!

Reply by Marian_in_CA on 6/14/09 2:35am
Msg #292280

Re: I-9 Have recently changed in the last few months...

Gald that worked out! Thing is, though... just because a form does not NEED to be notarized does not automaticially mean that it can't or shouldn't. Does that make sense?

Both times that I notarized the signature of the employee on the I-9, I did it as a standard notarization with their picture ID. The employer already verified their eligibility to work electronically, so the employee only needed to send in a specific ID document on list B -- not all of those documents are picture IDs, though. They can send in a voter registration card if they wanted to - the employer cannot dictate a specific type of ID, it just has to be on the list.

Getting the signature notarized is one way to skirt around the a bit. Both times the employer simply asked me to notarize the signature with an acknowledgment. They didn't want a copy of their ID... but they knew that in my role as a notary, I would have seen the ID and my seal was sufficient for them to know that the person who signed the form really is who they say they are. That, in conjunction with the ID they were FedExing over (which I understand was later returned) made the employers happy. Both times this was perfectly legit because I was not acting in the role of an employer or filling out their section.

Reply by parkerc/ME on 6/14/09 7:28am
Msg #292283

Re: I-9 Have recently changed in the last few months...

Thanks, Marian. I'll make a note of both ways that the I-9 can be handled. In this case, the employee is not FedEx'ing anything to employer, so I'll be their authorized rep for Sect 2. But good to be prepared for the other! I've never done these before . . since up to my retirement a year ago, I was just doing notarizations on a military installation. Good to have this info for my notes!

Reply by Cari on 6/14/09 8:30pm
Msg #292299

E-Verification....

is by far the best, and paperless way to provide employers with employee verification...and a great way to make extra money!

Reply by Marian_in_CA on 6/14/09 10:12pm
Msg #292304

Re: E-Verification....

It sure is... I signed up to do it about 6 months ago and offer it to my VA clients. They think it's just awesome.

Reply by Linda_H/FL on 6/15/09 9:58am
Msg #292318

Cari & Marian...is that the TEA training n/m

Reply by Marian_in_CA on 6/15/09 11:07am
Msg #292322

Linda... it isn't for me...

Every time I've tried to enroll in the TEA thing, I get the usual message that they're not accepting any more applications for my area. I guess only a handful of California notaries got in on that.

For me, I am a Designated Agent and am able to perform the verifications on behalf of other companies. I suppose being a DA might be part of the TEA program, but I'm not sure.

It is NOT an immigration tool at all... at least not in the way I look at it. It is simply a tool used to verify that a new hire is eligible to work in the U.S. based on the information they provide to their employer. It can, and does, weed out a lot of those who are illegal or using stolen IDs. It's not perfect, though... false non-confirmations happen all the time... but it's up to the employee to choose to protest it or not. If they don't protest it... they don't work. Period. If they do protest it (and the legit ones always do) then there is a whole process in place to handle that.


The trick is that once a company starts using E-Verify, they need to always use it to screen their new hires unless they quit using it entirely. So, it can be a source of income if you work with companies who would like to let you handle that verification. Of course... they can always do it themselves for free.... but they have to go through the whole set up and some employers, especially small business owners, don't want to be bothered. They'd just rather pay someone to do it. I charge a flat fee of $10 an inquiry, after the first one, which is $30, in order to cover setting the client up in the system and sending them the materials they'll need. That's way less than others charge. I've seen some people charge $60-$100 per new hire and I think that's way too much.

It's not that difficult to sign up to do it... you can do it all online. You just have to go through a long tutorial and take a test at the end. Once you get through that, you'll know what you're doing! A lot of tax professionals and notaries do this as an additional service.

BTW, I realized up above I said the notarized signatures on the I-9 were done after verification. I forgot to mention that the documents they send to their employers after an E-verify MUST have a picture on it. I think I wrote that when I was really tired. Ugh, I do that a lot.

Reply by Cari on 6/15/09 12:27pm
Msg #292330

No NOT TEA...which is a joke btw...

E-verification: go to the irs.gov website and search for the e-verification...you can sign up as a designated agent...it's great extra bucks...

TEA: I signed up in the beginning when the XYZ was advertising, and I have YET to receive work...what the heck was the purpose, you know?!

Reply by Linda_H/FL on 6/15/09 12:49pm
Msg #292334

Yep..I know..that's why I asked Cari...thanks!! n/m

Reply by PAW on 6/15/09 1:24pm
Msg #292339

Re: No NOT TEA...which is a joke btw...

Searching for "e-verification" on the http://www.irs.gov website -

Search Results

You Searched for: e-verification

0 results found

To conduct a new search, use the search field at the top right, or select Advanced Search for more search options.

Your search did not match any IRS.gov web pages or documents.

----- ----- ----- ----- -----

Are you sure it's the IRS website?

Reply by Marian_in_CA on 6/15/09 2:03pm
Msg #292343

Re: No NOT TEA...which is a joke btw...

Paul,

It's not the IRS website. It's a program from both Social Security and Homeland Security through ISCIS. The three of them work together to make it the verifications happen.

http://www.uscis.gov/e-verify

Select the Registration link on the right, and it will ask you some questions about how you want to use the system, and it should decide for you that you will register as a designated agent.

Reply by Linda_H/FL on 6/15/09 2:12pm
Msg #292346

Thank you Marian!! n/m

Reply by PAW on 6/15/09 5:47pm
Msg #292366

Re: No NOT TEA...which is a joke btw...

Thank you Marian, but I already knew about the SSA. (We're having a discussion about it. Us and the SSA, that is.) I was replying to Cari that the wrong website was mentioned in the post. I didn't know if there was another site that I wasn't aware of.

Reply by Marian_in_CA on 6/15/09 6:02pm
Msg #292367

Right... that's why I posted the correct URL. n/m

Reply by MistarellaFL on 6/16/09 9:48am
Msg #292399

NAICS Code?

Curious as to what others are using for their NAICS Code.
BTW, thanks for including this information and link.

Reply by PAW on 6/16/09 1:42pm
Msg #292431

What does "NAICS Code" have to do with this thread?

BTW, I've been using 541199 since ... well, forever.

Reply by MistarellaFL on 6/16/09 2:02pm
Msg #292437

Specifically, Paul, when you sign up for e-verify

they ask for your NAICS Code, and give several options.
I chose the one closest to what *I* do, collectively.
I was just curious about what every one else is using.

BTW, the code they call "NAICS Code" is only 3 digits, but the first 3 in yours are the same as mine.