Posted by LkArrowhd/CA on 5/16/09 8:54pm
Msg #288723

Signing Service keeping 62.5 percent of fee they are paid

if what is listed, is correct.

Reply by Calnotary on 5/17/09 4:27am
Msg #288733

Re: Signing Service keeping 62.5 percent of fee they are pai

There is a SS in orange county that pays only 90.00 dollars and they keep 110.00 and they don't pay more, they want fax backs. Are we talking about the same SS?

Reply by MistarellaFL on 5/17/09 10:02am
Msg #288740

That percentage is not uncommon

And one of the reasons I work with few SS.
The agency/agent fee ratio is waaaaay off.

Reply by Marian_in_CA on 5/17/09 11:04am
Msg #288742

Re: Signing Service keeping 62.5 percent of fee

See, that's just ridiculous from the notary's point of view.

Well, yes and no. And I'm not really defending SS's here... but I do see why they often keep a hefty portion of the notary fee. They have expenses, too. Having been in a similar position dealing with commissions to agents... I do get their position. Using a SS is a convenience to the notary, but it means lower fees to pay for that convenience. SS's are business, too, and they need to cover their expenses.

I think keeping $110 while giving the notary $90, though, is something they can't explain... especially when they hold on to said funds for weeks before paying the notary. That's just really disproportionate.

But then... people say that to me when I tell them that a $25 travel fee I want for driving 35 miles out to their home is ridiculous. This week a guy said, "I just have one paper that needs your stamp, lady! I'm not paying $35 for that." I politely told him that my going to his home was a convenience for him, and it would be a 70 mile round trip... and the $25 I'm asking is about a full third lower than my usual travel fee to that area. (I'm new to this area, so I'm taking a small cut on travel fees for a bit to get my name out there.)

I have a list of all of the copy, pack and ship stores with notaries in the area, and I told him that if he wanted, he could go to the nearest one. As it turns out, the nearest one to him meant about a 20 mile round trip. I also offered to give him the numbers of some notaries who might be closer to him, but couldn't guarantee they were available. I gave him every possible option, but he called me back 15 minutes later and wanted me to come out. Said he didn't want to "go out in the heat" and the other other notaries either wanted more money or didn't answer.

It's all a matter of perspective and convenience. The notary who relies on SSs for work won't put as much effort in to marketing directly to Title & Escrow companies, or other forms of networking and marketing. The ones with direct work may get more money up front, but they still spend it in other ways in running their business.

But yeah... any signing service keeping more than 50% is often (though not always):

1) managing their expenses poorly
2) ripping off their notaries, being greedy think it's easy money
3) both

Reply by LkArrowhd/CA on 5/17/09 2:24pm
Msg #288767

Re: Signing Service keeping 62.5 percent of fee they are pai

CalNotary I do not think we are speaking of the same one.

Reply by Les_CO on 5/17/09 11:17am
Msg #288744

Especially in CA the “notary fee” is not exactly what the borrower pays. Many times one will see a $175/$200 notary fee (in addition to a closing fee) and sometimes a $200/$300 ‘refundable pad’ fee to cover any miscellaneous costs that occur during escrow. I have actually spoken with borrowers after closing and they have been ‘refunded’ part of the ‘notary fee’. Don’t get me wrong some title (most) companies will keep the difference, and I’d think ALL the SS’s would. But when you’ve got guys like Nations Direct quoting prices like $100-$125, it’s very hard for a SS today to get $200-$250…most work for around, or under $150. So if the notary is dumb enough to take $50 they make 75% of the fee. Raise your prices, have others in your area do the same, and stop complaining about what someone else makes.

Reply by Adris Davis on 5/17/09 11:50am
Msg #288752

although I don't agree with the split if they call me and provide me with work that's money coming in that wasn't expected and 40 to 50% of something is better than 100% of nothing.

Reply by thnotary_NY on 5/17/09 12:33pm
Msg #288756

Times are bad, no question, but think about it for a minute. If you're offered a job for $40 or $50 and that's 40 or 50% of what they're getting, how is that paying your costs or putting food on the table.? You may get mileage credit at tax time, but you still have to put gas in the tank in the mean time. How much is your gas where you are, at 40 or 80 miles rt.? This kind of thinking (any job, no matter what) is what helps to keep the fees from rising to a level we can live with. Yes it's hard, but if we refused these low fee jobs, eventually we'd be able to command higher fees appropriate to the job. This is probably why I don't get as many jobs as I might, because I don't accept these low fees for distance travel. We could make a change, aren't there more of us than them.?

Reply by Les_CO on 5/17/09 12:56pm
Msg #288759

Well said….If I take a job at $125, knowing what the job entails, and the time/distance/costs to me involved, and then find out the SS made $300, for their “phone call” to me. Do I whine about it? NO! I set my price. Am I STUPID for charging so little? Are they SMART for charging so much? (and getting away with it) It’s still a (almost) a free country! It seems to me that those of us here that continually whine about SS’s have no clue about business. NO one (yet) sets your fees as a SA. No one (yet) says you MUST take the job. There are a few but perhaps a significant number of us that if they lived elsewhere, given their talents, would be stamping a$$holes in animal crackers in a cookie factory. Worry about what YOU make….Be thankful that someone called you for a job that without them you would NOT get. Set your price so that you can sleep at night….I do a job for my price…If the others in the chain make more…so be it. I didn’t make this world, but I must live in it.

Reply by MW/VA on 5/17/09 12:39pm
Msg #288758

I was of the understanding that notary signing came into being to save the borrowers the higher fees of using attorneys. In this business everyone finds a way to get a slice of the pie, and we often get what's left. I work with a few ss that are good to work with, they pay a fair fee & do their share of the work. The one's that get me are the ss that simply make the call, docs come from tc, etc. I don't have a big problem if they earn their share.

Reply by LkArrowhd/CA on 5/17/09 1:35pm
Msg #288760

Folks chill, it's a statement.

Reply by Jeff Ortler on 5/17/09 1:49pm
Msg #288763

You are obnoxious!!

"Chill" who the hell are you... are you suffering from a lack of oxygen to the brain from the high mountain air....

Reply by Jim/AL on 5/17/09 2:27pm
Msg #288769

Feel better now Jeff? Nice commentary...not. n/m

Reply by Linda_H/FL on 5/17/09 3:13pm
Msg #288770

Wow Jeff - don't think it's Sue who's obnoxious here.. n/m

Reply by Gary_CA on 5/17/09 3:34pm
Msg #288771

There's 26 good guys on here and 13 obnoxious.

It's always been that way, on any given day there are twice as many good folks as obnoxious ones.

Oops, wait a minute though, 26-13 is a different number, that's my Dodger's win/loss record. Best in baseball still.

Uggghhhh... evil triumps, put down one more obnoxious.


(I haven't done that in about 3 weeks now... I'm slowly reforming, the universe will be back in balance soon.)

Reply by Dennis D Broadbooks on 5/17/09 3:46pm
Msg #288772

Hey, Gary...

...did I tell you about this absolutely great article written by Andy Katz on ESPN.com on who he's predicting will be the #1 NCAA Men's Basketball team next year. Here's a link...

http://sports.espn.go.com/ncb/columns/story?columnist=katz_andy&id=4058254&campaign=rss&source=NCBHeadlines

I've gotta start putting a positive spin on ONE of my favorite teams! It ain't in the Cards right now.

Reply by Charles_Ca on 5/17/09 4:14pm
Msg #288774

To paraphrase a quote from you Jeff, what an

anal orifice you are!

Reply by MortgageDocs.com on 5/17/09 4:08pm
Msg #288773

One thing you have to remember is the fee you see on the settlement statement of $150 or whatever it is does not always get paid to the Title company because when the loan does not fund they don't get paid anything and lose 100's of dollars in time and expenses on those loans for all the other work done not just counting the notary piece. Same thing goes for the signing service if they are receiving the work from the Title company or directly from the Lender...if the loan does not fund they don't get paid.

The notary gets paid whether the loan funds or not so in that position you can't demand all or most of that fee...unless you want to start not getting paid when the loan doesn't fund?

Reply by Todd/OH on 5/17/09 4:27pm
Msg #288775

Everyone knows that all parties are screwed if a loan doesn't fund.

The fact is - the notary is the final step in the process and is often the only person to actually visit with the borrower. The notary is asked to assume some serious responsibility on each signing - verify ID, witness PROPER signature, make the process smooth. The notary must also handle funds when they are due.

Sorry, but the title company is collecting plenty of other fees to make up any difference, especially when a few loans don't fund - it's called fallout. I don't have much sympathy with a 62.5% notary retainer.