Posted by FP_CA on 5/1/09 12:23am
Msg #286970

Study Case about IDs

I will appreciate your input. I left from the bwr's house without doing this signing. Bwr's name in the paper work is Jane Perez (fake name for this case), in the DL and US Passport her name is Jane Doe (she is an American citizen). No credible witnesses available. Bwr showed me another current passport from another country (no Mexico, nor Canada) and her name in there was Jane Perez. This passport does not have any stamp from the US Immigration Services. I checked in the AKA names and Jane Perez. What would you do in this case? Thank you in advance.

Reply by Susan Fischer on 5/1/09 12:31am
Msg #286972

I'd call hiring entity and tell them my state law for

IDing a signer and justify my declination.

This evidence of ID would not fly in Oregon, although not for the lack of a stamp from the US Immigration Service in a foreign passport.

Reply by Shoshana Roller on 5/1/09 12:56am
Msg #286975

Does CA require an immigration stamp? Or was your reason for declining due to having 2 passports? Some countries allow dual citizenship.
In some cases, I have told the borrower that if they want to get this done tonight then they need to get the credible witnesses. She moaned and whined about it. Turned out her CA license had been revoked due to however many DUI's she had. She was even drunk at the signing table. I smelled her breath across the table. Where there's a will, there's a way.

Reply by GF_CA on 5/1/09 1:02am
Msg #286976

In CA we can use a passport issued by a foreign government, provided that it has been stamped by the U.S. Immigration and Naturalization Service or the U.S. Citizenship and Immigration Services

Reply by FP_CA on 5/1/09 1:28am
Msg #286977

The is the "doubt" that I have. Because she an American citizen, the U.S. Immigration and Naturalization Service does not stamp the foreign passport.

Reply by FP_CA on 5/1/09 1:29am
Msg #286979

Re: Study Case about IDs, let me fix it

That is the "doubt" that I have. Because she an American citizen, the U.S. Immigration and Naturalization Service does not stamp the foreign passport.

Reply by Marian_in_CA on 5/1/09 1:30am
Msg #286980

Re: Study Case about IDs, let me fix it

If she's an American citizen, she needs to get proper ID with her proper name.

Reply by CopperheadVA on 5/1/09 6:19am
Msg #286991

<< Turned out her CA license had been revoked due to however many DUI's she had. >>

That's when she needs to go to the DMV and get a state ID card. Not sure how anyone can function in this world without a state ID or DL (or military ID for those who are eligible). I doubt the grocery store would let her use two credible witnesses when she's writing a check!

Reply by Mary Ellen Harvley on 5/3/09 10:30pm
Msg #287178

Shoshana Roller,

Are you saying this lady was obviously imbibed and you notarized? 9After she got the credible witnesses)

Never been in that situation but I'd have to think about it. After all for a jurat you have to swear them in and ask them if the understand the docs, are signing of their own free-will, and are signing the docs for the purpose therin stated. (At least in Tn)

Not sure an intoxicated person would be considered legally able to answer those questions and it might come up in a lawsuit later.

Hmmm, I'll call a lawyer friend, no answer from the SOS ever except, "We leave that up to each individual notary."

Reply by Marian_in_CA on 5/1/09 1:28am
Msg #286978

No stamp? No go.

CA requires that in order to accept a foreign passport as ID, it must be stamped.

Without credible witnesses (who must have legit ID themselves!), she's out of luck. Unless she happens to work for a CA city, county or the state and can provide her employee ID card that contains all of the required elements.

In this case I'd giver her a copy of the state law the dictates what I can accept as ID and let her know that when she can provide one of those, I'd be happy to complete the work for her.

Reply by GF_CA on 5/1/09 1:38am
Msg #286981

Re: No stamp? No go.

One time I had a signing and the wife last name did match the loan docs. She is been married for 3 years and never changes the last name on the ID, no credible witness available. She told me “I am not ready yet”… I told her “give me a call when you are ready.

Reply by GF_CA on 5/1/09 1:44am
Msg #286983

the wife last name did NOT match the loan docs....sorry n/m

Reply by Teddog/CO on 5/1/09 8:18am
Msg #286994

Re: No stamp? No go.

No current Government issued photo ID. Sorry no can do.
No one is that busy that they can't even get a State photo ID. As it was stated before "how can anyone function in this society without a proper photo ID."
I just had a signing that almost didn't happen because the co-bwr didn't have a current driver's license, expired a year ago. Good grief!! Fortunately his wife remembered that he had a US Passport. That took a 1/2 hour to find.
Just like bad little kids. The title company tells them they will need ID's and when we confirm the appointment we tell them to have copies of current photo ID's. Go figure.

Reply by MikeC/NY on 5/1/09 5:55pm
Msg #287067

Re: No stamp? No go.

"I just had a signing that almost didn't happen because the co-bwr didn't have a current driver's license, expired a year ago. Good grief!!"

Unless your state requires that the ID be current (and I realize that some do, and that yours may be one of them), why should this be a problem? Do you suddenly stop being who you are because you passed an expiration date? Can an identity actually expire, and if so, can someone else claim it? What if someone steals your ID - do you get it back after the first one expires?

I'm just joking around here, but this is the one part of IDing people in other states that I've never fully understood. If you're standing in front of me and produce an ID with a photo that looks like you, a description that matches, and a signature that's close to what you've signed... I'm supposed to decide if you're really you based on the date of the ID?

Yes, obviously, if required by law, but common sense tells me there's gotta be a better way...

Reply by Gary_CA on 5/1/09 9:51am
Msg #287004

By the way, I wouldn't have done that one with CW either

You have satisfactory evidence that she is NOT Jane Perez so I would not accept two witnesses telling me otherwise. It's probably just a married name issue but it needs to be ironed out before you notarize.

Leaving was the right thing to do. Bummer.

Reply by HKB on 5/1/09 1:08pm
Msg #287025

May be ?? !!!

I have a friend who has dual nationality and is a US citizen. Her new passport too is not stamped by USA, this is because it is a current passport and she has not travelled any where to have it stamped. (Every country here in US has its own embassy to issue passports etc.) thus the new one is blank …no travel stamps on it. Her old passport expired and had all kinds of stamps on it.

May be this was the case with your client too but one must always have a current ID …. I wonder how she gets by in her daily life without an ID

Reply by jba/fl on 5/1/09 1:25pm
Msg #287026

Re: May be ?? !!! - no, another reason

Mr. A, the ex, has 2 passports. When he enters the US he uses American and they have no reason to stamp it; when he goes to his country he mostly uses that one, again, no reason to stamp it. There are some countries he always uses US for expediency; other's his native country, again, for expediency. Also, some countries don't like the US but like him better as his original citizenry. Me, on the other hand, I always get to remove my shoes in the airport. (not funny)

Reply by HKB on 5/1/09 2:54pm
Msg #287035

Re: May be ?? !!! - no, another reason

Just for information ..... dont airport officials have to enter an exit and entry date on it ... just for record sake that the person was out of country..... I assume that the country one is entering also will have to enter the entry and exit date for their record sake.


Just thinking ... how can one prove that he was out of country.

Reply by NotaryGirl71 on 5/1/09 3:30pm
Msg #287042

Remember in the state of California a foreign passport is acceptable ID only if it has the following:

photograph,
description of the person
signature of the person
and an identifying number
must be stamped by
US Immigration and Naturalization Service or the U.S. Citizenship and Immigration Services

This is straight from the 2009 CA notary Handbook.

I have yet to ever see a foreign passport that has a description of the person

Reply by HKB on 5/1/09 3:52pm
Msg #287049

I dont know for sure but I feel description would be height, weight, color or eyes, color of hair etc..... I assume

Reply by HKB on 5/1/09 4:01pm
Msg #287050

This is an interesting thread ...... I have to leave in a few.

One more question ..... If the passport with US Immigration & naturalization stamp expires then what?

I think I will be back tomorrow to check this thread .... very informative .... I can face same situation one day .... never thought of this scenario before.

Have a great evening

Reply by FP_CA on 5/3/09 3:47pm
Msg #287155

Thank you for your replies. Last Friday, I received a phone call from her agent saying that they have 2 CWs. I called Escrow and I told them that I feel very uncomfortable doing that signing were two approved IDs are telling that she has one name and 2 CWs saying that she got another name.