Posted by Marian_in_CA on 11/19/09 11:11am
Msg #311550

CA notaries... wording used for journal copies

I can't believe that I've not considered this one before, but it's come up that I need to certify a copy of some journal entries. No big deal on my end... but it may end up with me being interviewed by Immigration people instead, not sure. Again... no biggie for me. I figure, with the number of trips I make to our ICE detention center, it had to happen eventually since these guys are usually trying to prevent deportation.

It occurred to me that I don't have any wording for journal entries. I suppose we could use something similar as we would for POA copies, right?


Grrrr at the SoS for not giving us examples on this one. It's as if we're free to do it however we want. I called the SoS office, and they said, "Do what is says in the journal." Yeah... helpful, thanks.

My head is a bit numb this morning... so I'm going to be admittedly lazy and ask if any of you have wording that you've used for journal copies?

Reply by John Schenk on 11/19/09 11:21am
Msg #311551

Here's something I used before.

State of Texas

County of Wichita

I, ___________________________________, a notary public, do certify that, on
the ______ day of ________________________, 20____, I personally made the
attached copy of these pages (or this page) of my notary journal from the
original, and it is a true, exact, complete, and unaltered copy, kept in the normal course of business, and such entries in the journal were made at, or near, the time reflected in each journal entry.
(seal)
_______________________________
Notary Public
My commission expires ___________

Reply by JAM/CA on 11/19/09 1:18pm
Msg #311564

I've always wondered about this Marian. How do we "certify" one of our journal entries. We can't notarize our own signature. The one and only time I was asked by a member of the public for a copy of a line item in my journal. I had them write to me with pertinent information by mail and simply copied the line item they were requesting and sent it to them. Covering up other line items, of course.

Please let us know how you end up handling this. I guess you could put that you certify this journal entry to be true and accurate, date, time, place, etc. and sign your name??? You certainly can't stamp. It's not like a "Copy Certification of POA", there you are notarizing someone's signature.

Reply by John_NorCal on 11/19/09 1:26pm
Msg #311566

I like John's sample, I think it covers just about every thing. As for stamping the certification, I would think that would be the only time it could be used in this type of situation, it's more of a proof and cerification of your office, not a normal notary function.

Reply by davidK/CA on 11/19/09 3:36pm
Msg #311607

John I disagree about applying your Notary Seal. n/m

Reply by davidK/CA on 11/19/09 3:36pm
Msg #311608

John I disagree about applying your Notary Seal. n/m

Reply by davidK/CA on 11/19/09 3:39pm
Msg #311609

Re: John I disagree about applying your Notary Seal.

Third time is the charm.

Since you are not notarizing your someone's signature with the appropriate CA language your seal cannot be used for any purpose on the document.

What I would suggest that you include your commission number and expiration date as further evidence of authentication.

Reply by Marian_in_CA on 11/19/09 3:59pm
Msg #311612

Re: John I disagree about applying your Notary Seal.

Well, no.... I know we put our seal on the document. That part I DO know... the law is that the seal cannot be affixed to a document without proper notarial wording. They never say that the seal must be affixed in conjunction with somebody's signature. Normally, the two are not distinct... except for the two specific instances that are allowed: POA and Journal copies.

POA copies I've done many times. Always used my seal.... right in the handbook, the suggested certificate wording for certifying a POA includes the use of our seal.

Therefore, it stands to reason that we would also use our seal when certifying a copy of our journal, too.

That said, I was PMd the following example from somebody, and I really like it:

=========
State of California
County of ________

I (name), Notary Public, certify that the attached reproduction of a notary journal entry involving (name of signer) on (date signed) is a true and correct copy of the original in my possession. This copy certification is made pursuant to California Government Code 8206.


___________________________________
Signature (seal)
===============

Reply by John Schenk on 11/19/09 9:52pm
Msg #311637

You disagree, but your form says SEAL

Here's what your code says:

(c) Upon written request of any member of the public, which
request shall include the name of the parties, the type of document,
and the month and year in which notarized, the notary shall supply a
photostatic copy of the line item representing the requested
transaction at a cost of not more than thirty cents ($0.30) per page.

Its also states this:

(e) The notary public shall provide the journal for examination
and copying in the presence of the notary public upon receipt of a
subpoena duces tecum or a court order, and shall certify those copies
if requested.


Form looks fine to me, but I don't know where I ever said NOT to use your seal, did I? I was the first one to throw one up there, and certainly didn't certify it to be CA compliant in any way.

The form I proffered included what would be considered as a "business records certification," in addition to a certification of your journal entry. It may be above and beyond what you want to certify. Do what you've comfortable with. I keep good records so it didn't bother me.

Glad you found one you like, Marian! :-)

Reply by LKT/CA on 11/19/09 2:22pm
Msg #311578

<<<I suppose we could use something similar as we would for POA copies, right?>>>

I would keep it simple by tweaking the California POA certified copy wording.