Posted by Notarysigner on 9/12/09 11:19am
Msg #303640

US Certified Signers

update ..... US Certified Signers , which threatened to sue me,..hasn't.

..Unprofessional, belittling in character and refusing to pay me (for two signings) because I refused to sign their Notary agreement. I did the jobs, they got paid, I didn't.

From the post I see, most people think they are a great company to work for. Agreeing to take full responsibility for a lawsuit against THEM is just plain stupid. I understand why seasoned, professional notaries generally do not accept assignments requiring you to sign "Notary agreement". If you're willing to shoulder complete responsibility for lawsuits against SS you are making a grave mistake.

Empathy for borrowers has no place when it comes to dealing with SS. Read those agreements people. Thanks to those peers who added their advise and support.

Reply by LKT/CA on 9/12/09 1:46pm
Msg #303646

US Certified Signers are located in Sacramento, CA. Here's what a portion of the customer agreement says:

<<< * I have agreed to complete this signing as an independent contracted notary and will not participate in any illegal

activity while doing so. If I participate in any illegally activity or I am accused of participating in any illegal

activity I will not hold U.S. Certified Signers responsible for my illegal actions. I agree to take full responsibility

if U.S. Certified Signers and or its partners are named as a defendant on behalf of my illegal or legal actions, allegations of illegal activity or claims regarding errors and or omissions. >>>

Notarysigner wrote: "Agreeing to take full responsibility for a lawsuit against THEM is just plain stupid. If you're willing to shoulder complete responsibility for lawsuits against SS you are making a grave mistake."

Maybe we are comprehending things differently because what I read was: If USCS or its partners are named as defendents for something YOU did, you will take responsibility for it. In other words, you are an independent contractor and they won't be made responsible for YOUR actions, illegal or legal.

Of course, it's up to each individual as to whether they will sign the Notary Liability List. Only you can make that decision. As to them being unprofessional and belittling in character - I cannot comment on that as I have not experienced that.

Reply by Notarysigner on 9/12/09 2:00pm
Msg #303647

Read,....."my illegal or legal actions, allegations of illegal activity or claims regarding errors and or omissions".
I'm not a member of the bar but I do know we pay for error and omission insurance. Of course that is for LEGAL ACTIVITIES. That is understood.
In a lawsuit, ALL parties are named and if you've never been the victim of an attorney exercising a "modified verdict", consider yourself lucky.
I believe the forum is a place to exercise our opinions from personal experience; I did and so did you!

Reply by John/CT on 9/12/09 2:38pm
Msg #303649

But, our notary E & O insurance doesn't cover ...

any activity (legal or illegal) outside the narrow scope of our notary public duties.

Reply by MW/VA on 9/12/09 4:05pm
Msg #303653

Re: But, our notary E & O insurance doesn't cover ...

Notary E & O insurance only covers unintential errors in a notarial act. It does not cover us as notary signing agents--that requires a different type of insurance.

Reply by Sylvia_FL on 9/12/09 5:35pm
Msg #303657

"" on behalf of my illegal or legal actions, allegations of illegal activity or claims regarding errors and or omissions"

Only regarding YOUR illegal or illegal actions or allegations of illegal activity etc."

You should take full responsibility for a lawsuit against them that is based on your actions or allegations regarding your actions.

Reply by LKT/CA on 9/12/09 6:09pm
Msg #303658

<<<You should take full responsibility for a lawsuit against them that is based on your actions or allegations regarding your actions.>>>

Exactly!! That's what I tried to tell the first poster but I guess he doesn't see or agree with that. Maybe I didn't express my thoughts clearly enough.....but you did Sylvia, and hopefully the first poster will understand what you wrote.

Reply by ChristineHI on 9/12/09 7:38pm
Msg #303665

I just want to say first that this company is one of my very favorites. They have always been wonderful to work for. I've worked with them for years and consider them one of the best.
I don't understand why you did the signing if you were not going to sign the agreement. If I don't agree with an agreement I don't do the signing. I know it is a requirement. I don't think there is anything unreasonable in that either.

Reply by MW/VA on 9/12/09 8:18pm
Msg #303678

I agree with this. Accept the terms of the signing or not. IMO, you cannot dictate your terms to override theirs. It's a contractual relationship, whether you sign an agreement or not. Also, there isn't anything necessarily wrong in signing Independent Contractor Agreements. If I were an ss you can bet I'd require one. It clearly defines who is responsible for what.

Reply by MikeC/NY on 9/12/09 10:57pm
Msg #303702

While I agree that the notary should take responsibility for his or her own actions, I think the point that everyone is missing here is that James did the signings and they refused to pay him. Plus, if I recall the original post correctly, he didn't find out about this requirement until after he had already accepted the jobs and received the docs.

You can't add conditions to a contract after the fact, so if the job is completed according to the originally agreed upon conditions, the notary has earned his fee. The deals closed, they got paid, so why is he left holding the dirty end of the stick?

Reply by Notarysigner on 9/13/09 2:20am
Msg #303710

Finally s o m e b o d y get's it......in my previous post the Scheduler, Stephen, who I HAD WORKED FOR BEFORE knew my feelings, he called because he SAID he was tired of trying to get someone to go the A N O T H E R city for a borrower who was going on Vacation the next AM. He had two signings there. It was late the evening before when I got the call. Although I disagreed with the policy, I had EMPATHY for the borrower (my previous post explanation was...Silly me). I had been paid by them ( USCSS ) before, WITHOUT actually signing that agreement....I did the work, not them. They were paid, not me. Serve the public IS WHAT I WAS DOING, I THOUGHT, NOT THE SS........Again Silly me. I said previously, people express the view they are a great company to work for, this was my experience and I still haven't been paid. Values morality honestly character are a few words I try to live by daily. I have not seen any of these items in this wonderful SS actions. Of course they're not me....I'll live. Thanks Mike.

Reply by MW/VA on 9/13/09 8:44am
Msg #303718

I think if it was me, I would drop the whole contract signed or not issue & start collection proceedings. Some notaries here have reported good success with D & B Small Business Solutions. Your objective here is to get paid--pure & simple.

Reply by Notarysigner on 9/13/09 10:47am
Msg #303724

I couldn't find better words, pure & simple.

The responses I've received via "private messages" are overwhelmingly supportive and quite different then what is reflected in the postings. However, I would like to say the forum is for all of us and I know we all learn from what we read even if we don't respond. I'm a better notary/person because of it, no matter whether I like or dislike what is said. Thanks James

Reply by mwm143 on 9/13/09 11:25am
Msg #303726

You should be paid regardless of a signed agreement

I believe the topic at hand was actually about a SS withholding payment because you refuse to sign an agreement.

Were you you presented with the agreement before you accepted the assignments or after they were completed? If after then they absolutely owe you your fee. You accepted the assignments as they were presented by the SS. If before then again they absolutely owe you your fee. They were remiss for not collecting those signed agreements prior to sending you not one assigement but two.

Reply by Notarysigner on 9/13/09 12:05pm
Msg #303729

Re: You should be paid regardless of a signed agreement

Yes, someone else expressed that same sentiment....calling it "Payment hostage" LOL

Reply by MW/VA on 9/13/09 1:51pm
Msg #303736

Re: You should be paid regardless of a signed agreement

IMO it's not a lot different than notaries who think they can hold docs hostage in an attempt to get some leverage for payment. This is never done. The contractual agreement is fairly simple. We take the assignment, complete it, and are due payment. Anything else becomes just excuses for non-payment, IMO.

Reply by JanetK_CA on 9/13/09 10:41pm
Msg #303778

Re: You should be paid regardless of a signed agreement

"...excuses for non-payment..."

I heartily agree! If the work was completed without any problems, payment should be due regardless of what was or was not signed. There's presumably a verbal agreement up front, so there is no excuse for not paying for a satisfactorily completed assignment.

One of my pet peeves is being told after-the-fact that "we need a copy of our agreement signed for our files before we can pay you" after handling a last-minute request for someone. If they don't want to call me back again, their loss (imnsho... ). However, signing their agreement (especially when you didn't have a chance to read it beforehand) should never be a condition for payment, unless perhaps, that fact was *specifically* disclosed up front in the first phone call - (and not just smoothed over).