Posted by Michelle/AL on 4/23/10 2:08pm
Msg #333057

Notary Journal Requirements

I find it difficult to understand why some states don't require that a notary maintain a journal documenting the each notarization that takes place. I just received a phone call from an attorney. I notarized a signature on a POA in 2008. There's now a dispute and a lawsuit pending. I was able to ask the attorney for the date of my signature, look up the transaction in my journal and conduct an informed conversation with the man. Without the journal I wouldn't have had a clue. Just by seeing the the entry in my journal my memory was jogged and I was able to recall some of what took place during the signing of the form.

Even if Alabama didn't require or encourage use of a journal, I'd use one anyway.

Reply by Linda_H/FL on 4/23/10 2:10pm
Msg #333058

We have no journal requirement here

but I use one anyway....

Reply by Roger_OH on 4/23/10 2:42pm
Msg #333066

Just for discussion, in those non-journal states...

such as here in Ohio - what happens if you DIDN'T have a record of a particular signing? Since it's not required, is the notary legally exposed, and how?

Reply by Robert/FL on 4/23/10 2:46pm
Msg #333068

Re: Just for discussion, in those non-journal states...

In FL, where journals are not required, the notary I suppose is just expected to remember the transaction. I have come across case law where an 83 year old retired notary was called to testify about an affidavit he notarized 25 years earlier - all he could do was identify his signature and seal...

Reply by SharonH/OH on 4/23/10 3:12pm
Msg #333077

And as a follow up to that.....

When you DO keep a journal in a non-journal state, as I do, what do you do with it when you retire -- or what happens to it when you die? I don't think our Clerk of Courts will take it, as they would with a notarial protest journal. And I'm pretty sure our SOS wouldn't.

Reply by Robert/FL on 4/23/10 3:20pm
Msg #333085

Re: And as a follow up to that.....

Upon my death I plan to donate it to the Special Collections office at our local university. They have tons of that kind of stuff, including books and books of original marriage records for my county.

Reply by parkerc/ME on 4/23/10 3:43pm
Msg #333099

Re: And as a follow up to that.....

In my state, journal not a requirement but "recommended". Upon retiring, any journals that are kept must be sent to SOS.

Reply by Linda_H/FL on 4/23/10 5:45pm
Msg #333129

Re: And as a follow up to that.....

My husband knows it's confidential - I've told him if anything happens to me to contact the SOS and ask them for direction on how to handle my stamp, embosser and journals....

When I first told him I got that "deer in the headlights" look...so I followed it up with "never mind...just talk to Attorney XXX about it...LOL

Reply by Notarysigner on 4/23/10 2:18pm
Msg #333061

Like Linda, me to....I often go back into my calendar to reference an inquiry ( It kinda helps me to remember what I was doing that day) but sometime I don't put last minute jobs on my calendar. Some notaries here even suggest numbering the docs. I don't have quite the volume but I do believe we should keep/log-in as much info possible for future reference.

Reply by Marian_in_CA on 4/23/10 4:18pm
Msg #333117

This is one of the reasons I've been wanting to convert to an electronic-based journal. That way, I can type it all up much faster, and with more details than in my paper based journal. However... I really like paper based records because they are more tangible and not as easily forged.

I've done plenty of electronic notarizations.... but still have a paper-based journal, which a lot of people find ironic.

Reply by LisaWI on 4/23/10 8:27pm
Msg #333147

Re: Marian......

Can you expand on the electronic-base journal? Is there such a thing? Im very curious

Reply by Sylvia_FL on 4/23/10 8:42pm
Msg #333154

Lisa


http://www.nationalnotary.org/enjoa/

Reply by LisaWI on 4/23/10 9:22pm
Msg #333164

Re: Lisa

Yep, after I posted it, I did a search and thats what I found I thought it sounded familiar. There is another company that is doing it too. Didnt go thru their website too extensively though.
In theory this sounds like a good idea, but I would have to really examine this alot closer to see if its something I would do. The NNA website doesnt have alot of detail, just a song and dance more or less.

Reply by Sylvia_FL on 4/23/10 9:31pm
Msg #333167

Re: Lisa

I remember a few years ago when they "introduced" it. A signing agent on another forum was commenting on it, and I forget the observations he made, but one stood out - if he dropped his notary journal nothing bad would happen, but if he had an Enjoa and dropped that it could be a catastrophe, so he would stick with a regular journal.

Reply by Linda_H/FL on 4/23/10 9:33pm
Msg #333168

Hasn't NNA stopped supporting that Enjoa? n/m

Reply by Sylvia_FL on 4/23/10 9:36pm
Msg #333173

Re: Hasn't NNA stopped supporting that Enjoa?

They still have an Enjoa

http://www.nationalnotary.org/supplies/index.cfm?product=07755

Probably a lot different than the original one.

Reply by LisaWI on 4/23/10 9:37pm
Msg #333174

Re: Good Point Sylvia

I'll stick with the ol tried and true.

Reply by Moneyman/TX on 4/23/10 2:32pm
Msg #333065

"Even if Alabama didn't require or encourage use of a journal, I'd use one anyway."

Good advice. As your story shows, it can be years from now that questions arise from what we do today.

Although we are required to keep a journal in TX, I am a big believer in CYA. Better to have too much info as opposed to not having anything when needed. JMO

Reply by RJE/MI on 4/23/10 3:03pm
Msg #333072

Although a journal is not a requirement in MI the SOS does state that we need to keep a record of all notarizations. How we do it is our business.

Because of the vague law most Notaries do not even know that they are responsible for record keeping.

I never even heard of a Journal until I quit working at TC and started on my own.

I can remember the TC manager telling us that if we are ever called to court our answer should always be "I do not recall."

I just recently completed a REO and when I asked the buyers to sign my journal the RE Agent said "Wow how fancy, just like you were getting married or something."

Reply by Mia on 4/23/10 3:19pm
Msg #333083

What?

You state -"the SOS does state that we need to keep a record of all notarizations"

The following is off the MI State website.......

"Notary Public

Should notaries keep a journal?

Answer:
The law does not require a notary to keep a journal or a specific type of record"

From Dept. of State – Terri Lynn Land, Secretary of State
http://www.michigan.gov/sos/0,1607,7-127-13762-93596--F,00.html

Reply by RJE/MI on 4/23/10 3:41pm
Msg #333097

It also states:

Under Record Keeping: "The Michigan Notary Public Act requires a notary to maintain all records of a notarial act for at least 5 years. A Notary is also required to provide copies of those records upon the request of the Department of State. However, the law does not describe the type of record that must be kept or what must be included."

Reply by Mia on 4/23/10 5:52pm
Msg #333131

That's right... it's not a Law

The SOS does not make the Notary Laws (PA, or Acts) - the MI Legislature does.

However, there is a recommendation.... & it is only a recommendation

"If you keep a journal, it is recommended that you record the signer's name, identification presented, date, and other pertinent information from each notarized document in the journal".

Reply by RJE/MI on 4/23/10 7:37pm
Msg #333142

Oh for Pete sake

That was my point. Keeping a Journal is not a law but the MI Notary Public Act requires a notary to maintain all records blah blah blah - see my post above.

Sorry I didn't make myself clear and may not have used the correct terminology. I was in a hurry.

Have a great weekend Mia!

Reply by Sylvia_FL on 4/23/10 3:15pm
Msg #333078

The Florida House and Senate passed laws a couple or so years ago that would require notaries to keep journals. However it was vetoed by the Governor. I believe he was concerned about the privacy aspect (IIRC)

Reply by Claudine Osborne on 4/23/10 9:30pm
Msg #333166

Ohio as Roger stated does not require a journal..Regardless I useone anyways. It helps to keep notes on what you have done and the signers usually think it is a great idea. I always tell new notaries to keep a journal and the best one IMO is the one sold here!

Reply by BrendaTx on 4/23/10 9:36pm
Msg #333172

*I believe he was concerned about the privacy aspect *

And, in Texas that's why the lawmakers peeled off the necessity of a signature, taking down of a TX DL #, and why they discourage the thumbprint.