Posted by Joshua Basil on 1/6/10 3:06pm
Msg #316975

Florida state notary law for 2010

I understand that in the past years in the state of FL a 2nd witness was not required for a standard DOT only when there was a change of ownership, i.e. a quit claim deed...I am being told by a Title Company that as of 2010 all DOT's in FL require a 2nd witness in addition to the notary. I have looked on the SOS web site and left a message at there office but wanted to see if any FL notaries know for sure if this is true and either way can direct me to some verbiage stating so.

Thank you in advance

Reply by jba/fl on 1/6/10 3:12pm
Msg #316978

First, we use mortgages, not DOT's.
We do have deeds, but they are (just dawned on me - just wrote this past day or two) with purpose: warranty, quit claim, etc. All deeds must have 2 witnesses, notary may be one of the witnesses.

I don't think the law changed 1-1-09; if so, many of us have not been notified. If I am wrong, someone will correct me soon and I'll take my 40 lashes with a wet noodle. Actually, would prefer 40 wet noodles to put in the chicken soup I am making today.

Reply by Jim/AL on 1/6/10 3:15pm
Msg #316983

I assume Julie means 01-01-10...it is just the vodka in the chicken soup, lol.

Reply by jba/fl on 1/6/10 3:20pm
Msg #316985

Yes - 1-1-10. Now I have to go to the store and get vodka! Cooking improperly is causing untold consequences.

Reply by jba/fl on 1/6/10 3:46pm
Msg #316996

As for the vodka remark: let it be known that I love Jim

and know that it was in jest - I am not the least offended. He is always a gentle man and gentleman; my skin is thick anyway, except when I scratch myself these days and it sure does appear thinner. I hate getting old(er).

Reply by Jim/AL on 1/6/10 4:34pm
Msg #317010

Re: As for the vodka remark: let it be known that I love Jim

It is good to be loved.

Comedy is the best medicine for everything.

Reply by MW/VA on 1/6/10 3:53pm
Msg #317002

Chicken soup w/vodka--I need that recipe!

Reply by jba/fl on 1/6/10 3:56pm
Msg #317003

It's much like the tequila cooking on leisure....Now, vodka sauce for spaghetti is to die for!

Reply by Joshua Basil on 1/6/10 3:20pm
Msg #316986

sorry I am being informed that all mortgages require a 2nd witness and are being kicked back by the county...

If any fl notaries know if this is true as of 2010 please let me know.


thank you everyone for your input

Reply by jba/fl on 1/6/10 3:24pm
Msg #316987

Sorry - since I am without vodka, I also forgot to mention all purchases need 2 witnesses. Talk about dragging info out of someone...

I am sorry. Is this a purchase? Then yes - 2 witnesses, one may be the notary. Unless, of course, the lender requirements state otherwise, in which case, those supercede all FL requirements.

(Apparently, my multitasking is suffering today)

Reply by jba/fl on 1/6/10 3:29pm
Msg #316989

Another exception I remember from a post while back

Dixie County, FL wants 2 witnesses whether mtg or deed. See message #315367. I think that is the only county in FL with that ruling....again, I could be wrong.

Reply by Jim/AL on 1/6/10 3:13pm
Msg #316981

Not claiming to know anything about FL notary law, but if this pertains to a particular closing I would follow the TC's instructions regardless of what is right. if you are asking in general I apologize for opening my mouth.

Reply by Linda_H/FL on 1/6/10 3:38pm
Msg #316993

FL Stat Chap 695.03 - acknowledged - no witnesses

695.03 Acknowledgment and proof; validation of certain acknowledgments; legalization or authentication before foreign officials.--To entitle any instrument concerning real property to be recorded, the execution must be acknowledged by the party executing it, proved by a subscribing witness to it, or legalized or authenticated by a civil-law notary or notary public who affixes her or his official seal, before the officers and in the form and manner following:

(1) WITHIN THIS STATE.--An acknowledgment or proof made within this state may be made before a judge, clerk, or deputy clerk of any court; a United States commissioner or magistrate; or a notary public or civil-law notary of this state, and the certificate of acknowledgment or proof must be under the seal of the court or officer, as the case may be. All affidavits and acknowledgments heretofore made or taken in this manner are hereby validated.

http://www.leg.state.fl.us/statutes/index.cfm?mode=View%20Statutes&SubMenu=1&App_mode=Display_Statute&Search_String=695.03&URL=CH0695/Sec03.HTM

That being said, Dixie County DOES require two witnesses on mortgages for reasons that are their own. I agree with the other poster - if title says do it, do it - you waste more energy arguing with them than just telling your signers to have a witness with them.

Reply by Linda_H/FL on 1/6/10 3:39pm
Msg #316994

Should have included this, Joshua, since you're in CA

(2) WITHOUT THIS STATE BUT WITHIN THE UNITED STATES.--An acknowledgment or proof made out of this state but within the United States may be made before a civil-law notary of this state or a commissioner of deeds appointed by the Governor of this state; a judge or clerk of any court of the United States or of any state, territory, or district; a United States commissioner or magistrate; or a notary public, justice of the peace, master in chancery, or registrar or recorder of deeds of any state, territory, or district having a seal, and the certificate of acknowledgment or proof must be under the seal of the court or officer, as the case may be. If the acknowledgment or proof is made before a notary public who does not affix a seal, it is sufficient for the notary public to type, print, or write by hand on the instrument, "I am a Notary Public of the State of (state) , and my commission expires on (date) ."

Reply by Sylvia_FL on 1/6/10 7:05pm
Msg #317025

Re: Should have included this, Joshua, since you're in CA

Do believe that Joshua is asking on behalf of his SS. he works (I believe from previous posts)
for Global Notary.

Reply by PAW on 1/6/10 7:45pm
Msg #317030

I do not know of any changes in the laws concerning mortgages or deeds as far as acknowledgment, recording or witness requirements. Florida does not use a Deed of Trust as the security instrument, but rather a Mortgage. DoT's can be used, but is very uncommon. If the security instrument is a Mortgage, witnesses are NOT required for recording, except in Dixie County. However, many lenders and title companies do want witnesses. In Florida, the notary taking the acknowledgment may also act as a witness. (The only time the notary cannot act as a witness is when the witness signatures are also being notarized, as in the case of a Will.)

If a deed (including a Deed of Trust) is executed for property located in Florida, then the execution must be witnessed by two witnesses (subscribing witnesses, which means the witnesses must also sign the instrument). The notary taking the acknowledgment can act as one of the witnesses.

Below are the applicable statutes for Mortgages and Deeds.

Florida statues do not require witnesses for mortgages: Florida Statutes Chapter 695.03
Acknowledgment and proof; validation of certain acknowledgments; legalization or authentication before foreign officials.--To entitle any instrument concerning real property to be recorded, the execution must be acknowledged by the party executing it, proved by a subscribing witness to it, or legalized or authenticated by a civil-law notary or notary public who affixes her or his official seal, before the officers ...

Two (2) witnesses required for deeds that convey property: Florida Statutes Chapter 689.01 How real estate conveyed.--
No estate or interest of freehold, or for a term of more than 1 year, or any uncertain interest of, in or out of any messuages, lands, tenements or hereditaments shall be created, made, granted, transferred or released in any other manner than by instrument in writing, signed in the presence of two subscribing witnesses by the party creating, making, granting, conveying, transferring or releasing such estate, interest, or term of more than 1 year, or by the party's agent thereunto lawfully authorized, unless by will and testament, or other testamentary appointment, duly made according to law; and no estate or interest, either of freehold, or of term of more than 1 year, or any uncertain interest of, in, to or out of any messuages, lands, tenements or hereditaments, shall be assigned or surrendered unless it be by instrument signed in the presence of two subscribing witnesses by the party so assigning or surrendering, or by the party's agent thereunto lawfully authorized, or by the act and operation of law.

DO NOT PUT A SOCIAL SECURITY NUMBER ON THE DEED/MORTGAGE
section 119.071(5), Florida Statutes, provides:
7.a. On or after October 1, 2002, a person preparing or filing a document to be recorded in the official records by the county recorder as provided for in chapter 28 may not include any person's social SECURITY number in that document, unless otherwise expressly required by law. If a social SECURITY number is or has been included in a document presented to the county recorder for recording in the official records of the county before, on, or after October 1, 2002, it may be made available as part of the official record available for public inspection and copying.


Attorney General Opinion AGO 59-229 (Nov 16, 1959)
At common law a mortgage was held to be the conveyance of the legal title to the property mortgaged, by way of pledge or security for the performance of the obligation mentioned (59 C.J.S. 27, s. 1); however, this rule is not followed in Florida, for in this state a mortgage conveys no title to the property mortgaged, but grants a specific lien on the property so mortgaged (ss. 697.01 and 697.02, F.S.). In lien theory states, such as Florida, a mortgage on real property is not real property, but is personal property (59 C.J.S. 251, s. 195). "A mortgage (in Florida) does not create an interest in land. It is a chose in action which creates a lien on land." (Waldock v. Iba, 114 Fla. 786, 153 So. 915). The pledge or assignment of the indebtedness secured by a mortgage on real property, to secure an indebtedness or promissory note of the mortgagee, is the creation of a lien or pledge of personal property (obligation secured by real estate mortgage) to secure an indebtedness. The payment of the obligation is, therefore, secured by a "mortgage, deed of trust, or other lien," not on real property but on personal property, and, therefore, not within the definition of class "C" intangible personal property contained in s. 199.02(3), F.S.