Posted by Kaci/TX on 6/2/10 4:53pm
Msg #339477

Backdate request turned down

All Star Title (Baltimore, MD) called me today, asked me to get a deed signed that was not able to be signed due to the borrower not having ID with the correct name during the closing yesterday. The company has super rating on Signing Central (http://www.notaryrotary.com/agency/details.asp?id=KIS6G6SI&rpid=1AAA00029766), so I was shocked when the woman asked if I would have a problem with having this deed signed and date it with yesterday's date.

I politely replied that the Texas Notary Handbook says that Notarial Certifications must be signed with the date that it is signed.

She said she would call the company and get back with me. They haven't called me back, so I guess they found someone who would or changed routes altogether.

I refuse to be dishonest, or to knowingly break the law. Does this happen often?

Reply by CopperheadVA on 6/2/10 5:01pm
Msg #339478

Yes, it happens on occasion. Good for you for saying no!!!

Reply by Notarysigner on 6/2/10 5:13pm
Msg #339481

I've had two request so far, didn't do it. thanks for posting the TC making the request. BTW, where you the original notary? If not, that might be the one they will try to contact with the offer of a little extra cash.

Reply by Kaci/TX on 6/3/10 9:08am
Msg #339565

I am not the original notary, I think it was at the local TC, but they are only open business hours.

Reply by desktopfull on 6/2/10 5:27pm
Msg #339483

In Florida it's illegal for them to even ask you to backdate, that's why they won't put it in writing.

Reply by Bob_Chicago on 6/2/10 5:58pm
Msg #339487

May NOT have been a problem. If the only document required

was the deed , it would have been ok if the deed were dated as at an earlier date,
so long a your notarization was as of today.
A deed's date should be on or before the date of the mortgage.
In commercial transactions , the mortgage is frequently signed and recorded prior to
the actual closing, so that title can be brought down showing the mortgage of record.
Thd deed is not signed until the date of closing and is dated as of the date of the mortgage,
or as of an earlier date. Perfectly legal, so long as it is notarized as of the date that the signer
appears before the NP.

Reply by Notarysigner on 6/2/10 6:16pm
Msg #339489

Re: May NOT have been a problem. If the only document required

Bob, doesn't the term "backdating" imply an illegal action in the mortgage world when it has to do with loan docs in general? I really don't know if there is a difference when it concerns "Commercial property". This I should know about. Could you please point me towards some specific procedural documentation regarding this if you know. Tnks

Reply by Bob_Chicago on 6/2/10 6:23pm
Msg #339490

Illegal backdating of a notarized document implies that

the doc is NOTARIZED as at a date prior to the date that it was signed before
the NP, NOT the date that the document bears.
No difference between commercial or residential, just used that as example
of a typical situation where dox (usually a conveyance deed) rountinely
bear a date prior to the date of actual execution and notarization.
Whole different issue if, for example, a NSA asks a bwr to date a TIL or RTC for a
prior date. That WOULD be a big no-no.

Reply by Notarysigner on 6/2/10 6:28pm
Msg #339491

just saying the term backdating should raise a flag

that's all. Thanks for responding.

Reply by C. Rivera Chicago Notary Services on 6/3/10 2:57pm
Msg #339597

Re: May NOT have been a problem. Yep it was Bob....

....."so I was shocked when the woman asked if I would have a problem with having this deed signed and date it with yesterday's date."
________________________________________________________
.... she was asked to backdate and sign/notarize the deed at the earlier date, so it is an illegal request..a HUGE no no...

Reply by Bob_Chicago on 6/3/10 4:43pm
Msg #339631

I do not believe that it was clear as to just what was being

requested..

"if I would have a problem with having this deed signed and date it with yesterday's date"

Signer signing and dating with yesterday's date - not a problem.
Notary notarizing with yesterday's date,-illegal.

Reply by Linda_H/FL on 6/2/10 6:10pm
Msg #339488

All I get is the login page...someone please p/m me

with the company name?

TIA

Reply by Moneyman/TX on 6/2/10 7:28pm
Msg #339496

Post is now linked :-) n/m

Reply by MikeC/NY on 6/2/10 6:47pm
Msg #339492

Did you have to notarize?

If it's a document that doesn't require notarization, they weren't asking you to do anything illegal. You may have overreacted...

As far as "Does this happen often?" is concerned, it happens more often than it should, most of the time because the lender is being anal retentive about dates. In most states, it really doesn't matter if the date on the document and the date the notary took an acknowledgment don't match because the acknowledgment doesn't have to be signed in front of the notary. Obviously, it DOES matter if it's a jurat...

Reply by Maureen_nh on 6/2/10 11:26pm
Msg #339545

Acks can be dated by the officer any time after the date of the doc as long as the signer is present.

Reply by JanetK_CA on 6/3/10 2:08am
Msg #339552

I thought your post was clear & you did the right thing

You stated that it was a deed, so it would need to be recorded.

The document date would already be printed on the document so there would be no need for someone to ask to have it "signed and date it with yesterday's date". Sounds to me like they were asking for a notary certificate to be falsified - and you correctly referenced the relevant information.

As for your question, it happens a lot more often than it should, although I don't think we ever get over the initial shock that someone could be so flagrant about asking for an illegal act. It's good that you were prepared and said "NO".

Reply by Kaci/TX on 6/3/10 9:24am
Msg #339569

Thank you all for your replies, sorry I wasn't on last night to answer questions. My daughter wanted to go to the barn an ride horses and my horse stepped on my foot so I was milking it for the attention and lying on the sofa with my foot propped up.

As for the questions, of course it had to be notarized, or it wouldn't have been a question. That's why they never called me back when I gave my reply about Notarial Certs. What bothers me the most is that they probably found someone who doesn't care or know the law and did it.

That's okay though, honesty is ALWAYS the best policy.

Reply by Kaci/TX on 6/3/10 1:42pm
Msg #339590

Renee at All Star called me and stated that she was sorry and that it was a misunderstanding. She said that she would make sure that all of her agents know the law in the state that they are calling. She was super nice and apologetic. She stated that after they talked to me they did not go through with this signing at all.

This company's ratings are super excellent. It seems that they pay well and on time. I would not mind taking assignments from this company in the future.

Just read your handbook so that you know what right is when you are asked to do something. Know the law, no matter what company you sign for, and stand on the right side of it.

Reply by C. Rivera Chicago Notary Services on 6/3/10 2:50pm
Msg #339596

I've been asked a few times this year, and of course, NO

WAY.....Kaci, YOU DID THE RIGHT THING...BRAVO!