Posted by pat/WA on 6/23/10 1:40pm
Msg #342131

borrower not on the DOT

I know we have been over this before. So, don't throw rocks
When the borrower is not on the DOT which marital documents does he sign? I think it is the RTC and the TIL but I can't remember if there are more.

Reply by Notarysigner on 6/23/10 1:45pm
Msg #342133

Let's see. Not on DOT? Not on note either?...then can't be his house or loan would be my answer.

Reply by Notarysigner on 6/23/10 1:47pm
Msg #342135

Of course in Ca this can happen but only if there is an intersposal Grant Deed.

Reply by pat/WA on 6/23/10 1:50pm
Msg #342136

This is Washington State and a community property state. When a borrower is married the borrower not on the deed is to sign the martial documents. I am having a problem remembering which documents are martial documents.

Reply by Notarysigner on 6/23/10 1:55pm
Msg #342141

Didn't mean any harm, sorry. BTW California is too! I only know the docs associated with the state of Ca. so I should not have tried to answer/help..

Reply by PAW on 6/23/10 1:56pm
Msg #342143

I think you're a bit confused

All persons with an interest in a property must sign the DOT, whether or not they are a borrower (on the Note). Now, if one person is not on the DOT, then that person wouldn't sign anything concerning the loan or property, except possibly an interspousal deed.

You keep asking what marital (not martial) documents need to be signed. That's an indication to me that the non-obligated spouse needs to sign the DOT, not the NOTE. The lender and/or title company makes the determination what other documents need to be signed by the NoBS. Typically, the other documents include the RTC (since all persons with an interest in the property have the right to rescind), if included and the TIL. Some companies also want all 'property' documents (affidavits of ownership, marital status, etc.) signed by the NoBS.

Reply by pat/WA on 6/23/10 1:59pm
Msg #342144

Re: I think you're a bit confused

You are right: DOT, TIL and RTC.

Thanks

Reply by Calnotary on 6/23/10 2:13pm
Msg #342148

I had a weird one too...

It was for an out of state refi, wife was NOT included in 1st page of DOT but it was in the signature page. And she just signed the legals. I called title and they said that it was fine, it was very weird. Husband was sole and separate.

Reply by Notarysigner on 6/23/10 2:02pm
Msg #342146

Thanks PAW n/m

Reply by LKT/CA on 6/23/10 2:31pm
Msg #342150

Not necessarily

<<<Of course in Ca this can happen but only if there is an intersposal Grant Deed.>>>

I've completed refi's where the spouse didn't sign a thing, nothing, zilch, nada.....**everything CA**, i.e.. property in CA, primary residence, borrower's CA - TC/Escrow are CA companies, in this community property state. ***That has been my experience***.

Reply by Calnotary on 6/23/10 2:34pm
Msg #342151

Re: Not necessarily Lisa...

I have done some of those too, but at the end the borrower tells me that they signed a Interspousal GD a few days before or just a QCD.

Reply by Notarysigner on 6/23/10 2:42pm
Msg #342154

Ooh Ooh....thanks Calnotary, I forgot about this one!.

Correct On refi for example it had already been done. Once I posted about this. I mentioned that the loan would not go through if there was no interspousal grant deed and my forum brothers and sisters torn me a new a$$hole about the UPL. Sooooooo NOW whenever this happens, I assume there's one on file and I don't worry about it, besides..Title knows best . LOL

Reply by LKT/CA on 6/23/10 3:42pm
Msg #342174

Re: Not necessarily Lisa...

<<<I have done some of those too, but at the end the borrower tells me that they signed a Interspousal GD a few days before or just a QCD.>>>

My bad, I was unclear in my specific point. Whatever paperwork is signed by spouse before or after the loan signing is fine. My point is, sometimes, there's nothing for the spouse to sign during the appt.

Reply by Sheriden on 6/23/10 1:52pm
Msg #342137

yes the TIL. Maybe they just forgot to put the person on the DOT?

Reply by Sylvia_FL on 6/23/10 1:55pm
Msg #342140

Pat
Check with the title company. Usually spouses sign at least the TIL and RTC, the Mortgage (DOT) and riders to the mortgage (DOT). But some title companies want others signed too.
So, best advice is to check with them.

Reply by LynnNC on 6/23/10 1:56pm
Msg #342142

I can't think of any situation where if a person is not on the DOT, he would sign the TIL and RTC. If a person is on the DOT, but not the TIL and RTC, they should sign those documents as well.

Reply by Doris_CO on 6/23/10 2:48pm
Msg #342155

As others have said, you must ask the title company which docs are to be signed. Is this a situation where the spouse is not on the DOT but IS on the loan?

Reply by Bob_Chicago on 6/23/10 3:57pm
Msg #342181

The laws of the state where the property is located

determines if a spiouse, not on title , has an interest in the property.
If so, they need to sign such dox a the TC/Lender believes are necessary to make
their interest in the property subject to the lien of the mortgage.
As others have said, these, generally include the mortgage/dot, riders, TIL (and itemizaton)
and RTC, plus such other dox as TC/Lender require.
Please not that do to loan preparation software issues, NBS is sometimes on first page,
sometimes on signature page, or not at all.
If instructions are not clear, and you know that a NBS is involved, it is never a bad idea to
chcek what , if anything , is required.

Reply by JanetK_CA on 6/23/10 4:26pm
Msg #342191

Gee, I see a clear trend here...

In case anyone has any doubt, several of the most experienced people on this board have said in various ways (with apologies to Clairol, for you old timers) "Only your tc/lender knows for sure..."

We shouldn't be telling the borrowers how it "should" be handled, but it never hurts to raise the question (preferably directly with the client, and preferably before the signing) in these types of situations.

If it's a case of a NBS who needs to sign certain legals, the complete list varies from lender to lender, even though certain docs (see Bob's list) are nearly always going to be on it. Each lender (and/or tc) has their own specific requirements and that's a decision we shouldn't be making. The information might be contained in the closing instructions, however.

Reply by Notarysigner on 6/23/10 4:52pm
Msg #342199

Re: Gee, I see a clear trend here...

the other side of it is, if you have to ask the TC what to do, they most likely won't call you again,,I know for sure that's the way the TC feels!

Reply by MelissaM_FL on 6/23/10 5:58pm
Msg #342220

I'd rather ask the question

and have title tell me, preferrably in writing, how they want an issue handled than to have it come back to bite me in the tushy. I always ask what docs a non-borrowing spouse should sign if it's either a new company for me or a state other than Florida.

One of my toughest lessons was to always have "someone", title or the SS, give me a written version of how they want a trustee or power of attorney to sign IN WRITING before the signing. I did my first one as an NSA the way I "knew" was right, then had to redo the entire package because the lender wanted it done a different way. Since I guarantee my work to be error-free, this meant I did that signing TWICE for free. You live and learn.

Reply by Yoli/CA on 6/23/10 6:11pm
Msg #342222

Totally agree with you, Melissa. n/m

Reply by Susan Fischer on 6/23/10 8:54pm
Msg #342251

What Bob said. n/m