Posted by cawest/PA on 3/14/10 5:19pm
Msg #327218

Timeshare relief ... maybe I have a soft heart

Ok here we go:

Saturday had a early closing at 8am and so I decided to take the timesharerelif offer as I had to go to a wedding that eve and couldn't take any closings after 2pm.

I never felt so uncomfortable as a Notary in my life ... what it was all about was about the downsides of owning a timeshare and how much a timeshare would cost in a long run and etc ...
I saw people paying THE COMPANY 3000 to 6000 dollars and at the same time signing over their timeshare ...

Now my job was to notarize the docs signing over the timeshera however I did not see a RTC in the docs.
I know that a timeshare is not really a Real estae ownership but rather an ejoyment ownership however I still feel that there should have been a RTC of some sort in the docs.

Yes I got paid right away after the job but still I do not feel that I will ever do this again.

Reply by Blueink_TN on 3/14/10 7:00pm
Msg #327223

I wouldn't sweat it...I'm sure those signers knew exactly what they were doing...The high pressure sales techniques administered by the salesreps are the real culprits here. You just helped them get out of a bad situation.

Reply by cawest/PA on 3/14/10 7:57pm
Msg #327229

maybe ... I just felt bad seeing those poeple paying those huge amounts to get out of a timeshare and not seeing a right to cancel.

Reply by Laura_V on 3/14/10 7:10pm
Msg #327225

I know what you mean!

I love to travel to different places so no timeshares for me.


And I really do know what you are talking about.

A college student who used to work for me was getting married right after college graduation. Her evaporated father wanted to give her his timeshare before the wedding so he wouldn't have to pay the annual taxes, dues, service fees, cleaning fees, etc.

She vented - loudly - about his urgency while she said "over your forgotten dead body."

Some of the fights were via phone at the office. Crikey! That gal had a temper! She died her hair black but there must be a redhead in there or at least in the bloodline.


But lots of people here have timeshares in Hawaii and other warm winter states because they use them as family or annual family reunion vacations. March Spring break with 3 generations, for example.



I had one timeshare appt that was super fun. It was for the sale of a Las Vegas timeshare.


A couple arrived. Both were very nice. The wife was fine. The husband was behaving VERY oddly.

Though he was well dressed, he had spoken very intelligently during the phone call to make the appointment.

Now was hemming and hawing and not looking me in the eye. His body was not facing mine - it was facing a floor corner of the room.


OK fine. We notaries see it all. I used to live in Berkeley.


Turns out husband is a VERY successful real estate broker.


He squirmed as he explained that it was a weak moment. (What was?) The kids threw them a 25 wedding anniversary in Vegas, they were VERY happy, love was in the air along with the champagne. He purchased a timeshare.

He apologized. Wife burst out laughing and I joined her.


Seal / oath and mini travel fee turned out to be $100. He reached into his pocket for a money clip. Sure enough there was a $100 bill.

He "non-chalantely" tossed it my way.

I looked at wife. She burst out laughing, I followed suit in a nano-second.


.

Reply by cawest/PA on 3/14/10 8:02pm
Msg #327230

Re: I know what you mean!

I guess high sales pressure gets people into the timeshare field.
Now my mother in law has one since over 20 years and enjoys visiting the world by exchanging her wekk for other destinations and also has the availabilty to buy like 12 weeks a year ... but than I do not want to inherit it ...

Reply by MikeC/NY on 3/14/10 10:49pm
Msg #327250

If I recall correctly, the rule is (was? I'm fuzzy on this) that if you sign a sales contract in your home, you have 3 business days to rescind. If you sign it on their turf, there is no automatic right to rescind. Maybe that's just here in NY... I know I've been to some sales presentations where the paperwork included a 3 day right of rescission, but that seems to be the exception rather than the rule.

Regardless, it's not your job as a notary to be concerned with what these people are signing - only that they are signing of their own free will. What they're paying the timeshare relief company is probably nothing compared to what they would be on the hook for if they held onto the timeshare....

You have to be comfortable with what you're being asked to do, so if this really bothers you're justified in refusing to do it again.

Reply by Jack/AL on 3/15/10 12:07am
Msg #327254

No RTC needed?

I have not been involved with timeshares as a Notary Public or REALTOR, but am a happy owner of one on Maui. As I understand the RTC to cancel, it applies when owners are refinancing their primary residence, or using the residence as security for financing another property purchase, but does not apply to a purchase or sale of primary residence or timeshare. Perhaps someone familiar with timeshare sales can enlighten me.

Reply by Jack/AL on 3/15/10 12:07am
Msg #327255

No RTC needed?

I have not been involved with timeshares as a Notary Public or REALTOR, but am a happy owner of one on Maui. As I understand the RTC to cancel, it applies when owners are refinancing their primary residence, or using the residence as security for financing another property purchase, but does not apply to a purchase or sale of primary residence or timeshare. Perhaps someone familiar with timeshare sales can enlighten me.

Reply by Pamela Hoyle on 3/15/10 12:36am
Msg #327257

Re: No RTC needed?

Timeshare relief clients are selling their timeshare, not purchasing, so no RTC? I did this and there was one couple there who had...12....t-w-e-l-v-e different timeshares, all different properties, most with multiple weeks. The maintenance fees, etc were crippling them. The company lived up to their name...every couple I signed was very relieved. Without knowing all the client's story, we really aren't able (or supposed to, for that matter) make a judgment. I'd do it again, in a heartbeat.

Reply by cawest/PA on 3/15/10 12:59am
Msg #327258

Re: No RTC needed?

I did not make a judgment but rather an observation that there did not seem to be a RTC as there is on many contracts realated to any kind of sale.
Perhaps you should contact them and offer your services for when they come around your area and it would be nice to see you link your name, I'll even give you their number so you can call and reserve your spot!

Reply by PAW on 3/15/10 6:54am
Msg #327264

RTC _may_ be required

Certain sales, beyond the mortgage of primary residence, do qualify for a right to rescind. The PA Legal Network has a brochure on the subject. http://tinyurl.com/yk2web3

This is a tri-fold brochure, so things may look out of place when viewed on your monitor. But if you print it out with duplex printing, then fold it into a tri-fold, the flow will seem more natural.

Reply by cawest/PA on 3/15/10 7:26am
Msg #327265

Re: RTC _may_ be required

Thanks, printing it out as we speak

Reply by CF on 3/15/10 7:41am
Msg #327267

Re: RTC _may_ be required

There are many business to consumer transactions that include a 3 day right to cancel. You can buy a vehicle and return it in 3 days in MI. Additionally, you can sign a contract for services agreement and cancel that w/in 3 days, example, new windows or siding. Now does that happen very often and is it advertised...of course not. You must be an educated consumer to know your rights!

As far as I know most "original" time share agreements have a 10 day rescission. As for the the relief sale of a time share...I have no idea.

Reply by cawest/PA on 3/15/10 8:05am
Msg #327269

Re: RTC _may_ be required

There is not much being said about it ... but a contract is a contract and most contracts have a RTC close included so I am digging ... not for the matter that I did not like what I saw but just for personal education. It is always nice to learn a bit more

Reply by Robert/FL on 3/15/10 8:20am
Msg #327272

For some people a timeshare can be a very good thing

that suits their needs.

Just because we hear all these horror stories about how much money they cost in the long run, I have a co-worker who has a timeshare and her family has a blast using it, and it is a reasonable fee for them to continue to use it.

On another note, my mom and step-father once sat through a time-share presentation in Las Vegas just because they were promised $50 in the end... and they did get their $50 after they had to speak with 3 salespeople explaining that they had no interest.

Reply by cawest/PA on 3/15/10 9:01am
Msg #327279

Re: For some people a timeshare can be a very good thing

Oh last year in Cabos San Lucas sat for 2 hours, got 150 dollars and 2 bottles of Khalua ... did not get a timeshare but went shopping with the 150

Reply by Sylvia_FL on 3/15/10 9:08am
Msg #327281

Re: For some people a timeshare can be a very good thing

" did not get a timeshare but went shopping with the 150 "

Girl after my own heart! LOL

Err what did you do with the Kahlua???

Reply by cawest/PA on 3/15/10 9:17am
Msg #327287

Re: For some people a timeshare can be a very good thing

well one bottle was used and the other came home for usage LOL
We were on a 5 day conference in Cabos for my husbands company and we were snatched into going to see the timeshare while we were strolling around ... they told us 2 hours and it was just a bit less than 2 hours ... than we went back shopping

Reply by mwm143 on 3/15/10 10:08am
Msg #327293

Robert - Timeshares a good thing?? Yeah Right!

My inlaws have RCI points with their time share being in Myrtle Beach. The total cost of these points was $46,000. That gets them 2 weeks per year. If they choose to go to a different property then there is a 13 month prebooking period plus a couple hundred dollar transfer fee. Their monthly maintenance cost is $260.00. Their annual property tax bill is $900.00. Their annual cost to to own these 2 weeks is $4,000 (of course that will continue to increase) That's forever and ever. I can go to VRBO.com and rent the same unit for a week for a one time charge of $1,000.00. I can purchase the same amount of points for $6,000.00 (they paid $46,000). When times are tight, guess what people stop paying first? Which results in the property management companies collecting less and less. Eventually not enough money to maintain the property and the pay the taxes....

Hey Robert, would you like to buy my inlaw's timeshares??

Reply by cawest/PA on 3/15/10 10:35am
Msg #327300

Re: Robert - Timeshares a good thing?? Yeah Right!

RCI ... let me look it up but I believe they are tangled in a huge lawsuit related to the points and the fact that few memebers are able to use their points as or they try to book to early and when calling back later they are to late and it was discovered that RCI is making huge profits renting the units out to non timeshare holders.

And enjoy because you will inherit of that timeshare

Reply by cawest/PA on 3/15/10 10:36am
Msg #327301

link to RCI suit

http://www.rciclassaction.com/faq.asp

Reply by cawest/PA on 3/15/10 10:38am
Msg #327302

Re: Robert - Timeshares a good thing?? Yeah Right!

be very cautious on not paying all your dues to a timeshare ... they first will attempt to collect slowly as interest gets added and after about 5 years they take it to Court get a judgment and can go as far as putting a lien on your assets ... happened to one of our friends who stopped to pay and man did it slam him back badly.

Reply by xnavyss on 3/15/10 11:00am
Msg #327304

I own three timeshare weeks, and happy

I have owned at least three timeshare at any one time for at least the last 15 years. I purchased all of them resale and did not pay more than $100.00 each. Yes they can be expensive once you factor in the Maintenance Fee's (which go up each year), exchange membership fee's, and exchange fee's.

Of the three that I currently own, my average maintenance fee including tax is $400.00 per week. RCI membership is about $90.00 a year - whether you own 1 timeshare week or 21 plus timeshare weeks. If you trade your week there is an additional $190.00 for the exchange. So, in my case if I were to exchange, which I do the majority of the time, each of my weeks cost me, approximately $620.00 per week.

For my average of $620.00 some of my exchanges (7 nights) in the last 3 years have been: 1 bedroom in New York City - twice; a 2 bedrooms in Gatlinburg, TN; a 1 bedroom in Nashville, TN; a 2 bedroom in Atlantic City, NJ; a 2 bedroom in San Diego, a 2 bedroom at Disney's Key West Resort.

I personally would much rather spend an average of $100.00 per night for a 1 bedroom than a standard hotel room.

Joe

Reply by cawest/PA on 3/15/10 11:19am
Msg #327306

Re: I own three timeshare weeks, and happy

400 dollars per week or year? Per week it would really not be worth it!

Reply by xnavyss on 3/15/10 11:52am
Msg #327320

Re: I own three timeshare weeks, and happy

You pay maintenance fee's, once per year for each week you own. So I pay an average of $1200.00 per year for the total M/F's on my 3 timeshares.

Joe

Reply by cawest/PA on 3/15/10 12:09pm
Msg #327324

Re: I own three timeshare weeks, and happy

and that is to use your assigned weeks? You than pay on top of that a fee if you want to use it in a different location? Is that correct?
I just never really looked into timeshares till I took this task on saturday.

Now let's say the building where your assigned timeshare is located suffers severe damages due let's say to a hurricane (I take that one because many timeshares are in Florida), is that a pmt on top of your annual fees or do your annual fees cover that?

Reply by xnavyss on 3/15/10 12:28pm
Msg #327326

Re: I own three timeshare weeks, and happy

Yes, in my post I talked about an appooximate $90.00 to the exchange company and $190.00 to exchange. The grand total in my case was about $620.00. That is the average of my M/F, exchange membership and exchange fee per week.

If you use the week when and where you own, you do not have to belong to an exchange company or pay the $190.00 for an exchange.

The M/F's does include insurance just like your home. HOWEVER, if the insurance does not cover the necessary repairs, the resort management company will impose an additional assessment to all of the owners.

On one of my Tennessee timeshare, I had to pay an assessment of about $200.00 about 4 years ago. The resort is located on one side of a lake and the homeowners association on the other side of the lake took the resort to court to try to prohibit them from using the lake. So the $200.00 went towards legal fee's, etc.. that was not planned for.

Yes I have heard of several Florida timeshares owners getting an assessment due to weather damage.

I get a breakdown every year on how much is taken in and how much goes out at each of the timeshares. It includes cost for employees, maintenance, utilities, furniture replacement, etc...

Reply by thnotary_NY on 3/15/10 7:21pm
Msg #327435

Re: Robert - Timeshares a good thing?? Yeah Right!

I have a couple of questions in this regard, or maybe comments.
Not that I know much about timeshares, but I've yet to hear of a MONTHLY maintenance fee. And I've yet to hear of anyone paying property taxes. I know you'll correct me if I'm misinformed. The fact that they paid as much as they did for the points, which by the way is optional, means they have more choice as to the type/place they can go. For example, if they wanted to stay at the best hotel in NYC, it might cost them 25k in points per night, which you couldn't do if you only had 10k in points in your kitty. And while your correcting me, could you explain what VRBO is.

Reply by Sylvia_FL on 3/15/10 8:16pm
Msg #327441

VRBO

VRBO = Vacation Rentals By Owner

http://www.vrbo.com/

Reply by mwm143 on 3/16/10 8:19am
Msg #327481

Easy research will answer your questions

Check out clarkhoward.com and search timeshshares and their future. More and more properties are unable to pay the taxes and maintain the properties.

Yes my in-laws pay a monthly maintenance fee totally $260.00 for time share points.
Yes my in-laws pay real estate taxes on their deeded portion of their base property located in Myrtle Beach.


Their annual cost just to keep their timeshare points is $4.000.00. And don't forget, if they decide to travel outside of a reasonable driving distance they are going to have to pay airfare.

Reply by meganPA on 3/15/10 2:24pm
Msg #327362

I did the same exact thing that you did with the timeshares on Friday in my area of PA. I did not sit in on the event, I waited outside the boardroom to be called in and notarized the single document I was there to notarize. It was none of my business what these people were doing. I did not look at their paperwork except for the one Limited POA I was notarizing for them. But I DID hear the person who was working with them tell them they DO have a RTC within three days.