Posted by Robert/FL on 5/6/10 7:54pm
Msg #335314

Does anyone actually do the raised right hand?

I've only ever seen court clerks require a raised right hand for an oath. I have never done it because I would rather not get the strange looks or get laughed at.

Is there anyone who has actually made a standard practice of requiring a raised right hand?

Reply by Linda_H/FL on 5/6/10 7:58pm
Msg #335315

Yes...I do... n/m

Reply by BobbiCT on 5/6/10 8:04pm
Msg #335319

I do.

The attorneys I work with like "watching my act," meant in a good way smiling.

Four times in Court I've seen defense attorneys drill police notaries on procedures during taking down "sworn statements" of witnesses and other parties in criminal cases. Kinda cool: goal to make it look like police officer messed up and that "confused" person, who is or has changed his/her story, did NOT understand what they were signing or did not known that it was under oath because "the formalities were not followed."

True or false, makes for interesting watching when the person in the witness box states, under oath, that s/he didn't know that they were swearing to it being "true" or "didn't know it was perjury", "didn't remember anything about an oath" etc. because s/he "just signed it. Best one was three sworn statements by the same person; all of which were different and conflicting. Everyone always remembers "my act."

Reply by LKT/CA on 5/6/10 8:06pm
Msg #335320

Yes n/m

Reply by Sylvia_FL on 5/6/10 8:10pm
Msg #335322

Of course I require it for jurats! n/m

Reply by John/CT on 5/6/10 8:14pm
Msg #335324

Absolutely! When I raise my right hand, they do likewise ...

as I begin the drill: "Do you swear or sincerely and solemnity affirm and declare ...." No strange looks or got laughed at when done in a straight-forward business-like manner.

Reply by Notarysigner on 5/6/10 8:34pm
Msg #335329

Once I omitted the work "affirm" and the borrow jumped up and vehemently yelled, "I ain't swearing to no fu$$ing God..."! I almost fell out of my chair and started to duck the anticipated bolt of lightin. LOL Man that was funny..... Now I tell them I'm going to give them an oath and I state the words I'm going to use in the oath and ask if there are any objections. The I raise my right hand and........

Reply by Notarysigner on 5/6/10 8:35pm
Msg #335330

meant to say "word" n/m

Reply by Robert/FL on 5/6/10 8:46pm
Msg #335334

Wow, I'm surprised that many do it! n/m

Reply by Sylvia_FL on 5/6/10 8:58pm
Msg #335335

Re: Wow, I'm surprised that many do it!

Why would you be surprised? I take my position as a public official very seriously and having a person that is swearing under oath raise their right hand is part of my duties.

It has been the traditional method of taking an oath since medieval times. Convicts were often branded on the right hand, and as convicted felons were disqualified from taking an oath, a person taking an oath would raise their right hand as proof they were not felons and could take an oath.

Reply by Robert/FL on 5/6/10 9:01pm
Msg #335336

Re: Wow, I'm surprised that many do it!

It's surprising because I have never seen it done by a notary. But then again, most notaries don't even administer the oath let alone demand a raised right hand.

Reply by John/CT on 5/6/10 9:05pm
Msg #335339

Generalizations, generalizations again Robert. :>( n/m

Reply by Marian_in_CA on 5/6/10 9:32pm
Msg #335345

Re: Wow, I'm surprised that many do it!

Robert, I'm actually surprised that you DON'T --- you say you don't ask people to do it because you don't want funny looks or getting laughed at? Seriously?????

It's traditional, yes.... and not necessarily required, but sometimes you just have to stick with tradition and ceremony. The reason it is done is because it is a physical reminder of the solemnity of the act.

In reality, it adds to the credibility of our office as a notary, too, enforces that we are public officials with the authority to put them under oath.

Reply by Sylvia_FL on 5/6/10 9:34pm
Msg #335346

Re: Wow, I'm surprised that many do it!

"But then again, most notaries don't even administer the oath let alone demand a raised right hand."

Just curious Robert, how many notaries have you actually observed to make that assumption?

Reply by Robert/FL on 5/7/10 8:53am
Msg #335389

Re: Wow, I'm surprised that many do it!

Sylvia, you know as well as I do that most notaries don't do the oath. I've probably had a hundred documents notarized in my lifetime, with notaries from banks, school, and my office. Never once have I had one administer an oath.

So yes, I think I have observed enough notaries to make the assumption.

Reply by Sylvia_FL on 5/7/10 9:05am
Msg #335391

Re: Wow, I'm surprised that many do it!

"Sylvia, you know as well as I do that most notaries don't do the oath"

No, I don't. And I have probably had my signature notarized a lot more than you have in my years in the USA. If you have had only a hundred notarizations, then that would be a hundred notaries (assuming they were all different notaries) so that is hardly most notaries when you consider how many notaries there are in Florida alone.
Now, you could say that out of the hundred notaries you have had dealings with most of those didn't administer an oath for a jurat. But most out of a hundred is a far cry from most out of thousands.

Reply by Robert/FL on 5/7/10 10:12am
Msg #335403

Re: Wow, I'm surprised that many do it!

OK - sorry I should have made it quite clear. Let me amend my statement:

"100% of notaries in the North Tampa, Fla. area who work in banks, law offices, and schools and who offer their services to the general public free of charge and who have offered said services to me, do not administer oaths".

Come on Sylvia. Get real.

Reply by Sylvia_FL on 5/7/10 10:18am
Msg #335404

Re: Wow, I'm surprised that many do it!

"Come on Sylvia. Get real"

Sorry Robert, it is you who needs to get real on this. You made a comment that most notaries do not administer oaths, when all you can really say with certainty is that it is 100% of the notaries you have encountered, who have provided you with notary services free of charge did not administer an oath.

I can say that most notaries do administer oaths, as all the ones I have had dealings with have administered an oath for a jurat.

Reply by GOLDGIRL/CA on 5/7/10 11:59am
Msg #335423

Yikes! I gotta go with Robert on this one

I don't know if "most notaries" fail to administer the oath, but I sure wouldn't be surprised. I've written on NR before about how my husband had 3 jurats he needed done. The UPS notary blazed through all 3 without any mention of an oath. (I believe there's now a $700 fine in CA for failure to administer an oath.) I have done loan signings for borrowers who were also CA notaries. They were shocked I did the oath - said they never did. Barely had any idea what was going on. At one of my signings, the Realtor and LO were present and rolled their eyes, giggled and snickered during the whole thing, like they had never seen this before and quite frankly, they probably hadn't. And more times than I could ever count, borrowers remark that they "never had to do this before," meaning the purchase notary and subsequent refi notaries skipped the oath. My husband and I have bought 3 houses - signed all at TCs - never once took an oath - and jurats were in the loan pkg. Also, I never require anybody to raise their right hand at a loan signing. I'll save the solemnity of that for a courtroom - or when I have given the oath to people who were tesifying over the phone in a court proceeding. Incidentally,in many courts, the Bible, raising of the right hand, etc. has been largely replaced (at least in many non-Bible Belt states) with a simple affirmation and scary threats about perjury. Or the person testifying is given a choice ...

Reply by Sylvia_FL on 5/7/10 12:27pm
Msg #335431

Re: Yikes! I gotta go with Robert on this one

"I don't know if "most notaries" fail to administer the oath"

This is true. You cannot say that most notaries fail to administer the oath. We can only speak of the notaries we have had contacts with. The ones I have dealt with have always administered an oath when required - but would I say that 100% of notaries do administer the oath? I couldn't make that statement, can only say that 100% of notaries I have dealings with have administered an oath when required.

Reply by parkerc/ME on 5/8/10 5:38pm
Msg #335570

Re: Yikes! I gotta go with Robert on this one

Me too, except probably not to the 100% extent. Many of my signers, after I've administered the oath, have told me that they've never had a notary give them an oath before. Of course, they may have only been signing an acknowledgement, but should've still been given the "do/did you sign this of your free will for the purposes therein intended." I rarely have them raise their right hand during an oath. Something about the "do you swear . . . under PENALTY OF LAW. . ." gets their attention right away.

Reply by EvaMarie Colla on 5/8/10 8:43am
Msg #335535

Re: Wow, I'm surprised that many do it!

i was told that if an oath is not taken properly it could possibly jeopardize the legality of the loan package.

Reply by kathy/ca on 5/6/10 9:02pm
Msg #335337

Always, I take it very seriously, why dont you? n/m

Reply by Marian_in_CA on 5/6/10 9:17pm
Msg #335342

Of course... n/m

Reply by Hugh Nations Signing Agents of Austin on 5/6/10 9:35pm
Msg #335350

It's unnecessary

Raising the right hand does not validate an oath, nor does failure to raise the right hand invalidate it. A courtroom proceeding is a far more formal affair than taking a medical records billing affidavit or affirming that your name really is Bubba Goenadds. In court, the truth of your testimony is being judged by a trier of fact, either a judge or jury. It makes sense that the solemnity of the occasion would be emphasized.

I don't find that level of solemnity necessary. What I think is required is that the signer understand they are legally bound to be truthful, and that they are not acting under coercion. That can be accomplished quite well without raising the hand to swear.

Reply by Claudine Osborne on 5/6/10 9:47pm
Msg #335352

Re: It's unnecessary

I always swear people in.. I raise my right hand and they follow along..I have gotten giggles and comments that no other notary has ever done this before! I explain that I must give the oath and its a matter of following the state law...then they appreciate it!

Reply by Marian_in_CA on 5/6/10 9:53pm
Msg #335354

Re: It's unnecessary

I get giggles, too... but I don't let that bother me. If they say anything, I tell them it's traditional, as if they were in a court room.

Obviously, it's *not* an actual court room.... but, it's no different. Maybe it's just me, but formality of the actual location aside, swearing/affirming something under oath is the same whether done on the witness stand, in a lawyer's office, at the UPS store or Starbucks, or even at the beach on a surfboard.

Reply by John/CT on 5/6/10 9:50pm
Msg #335353

Re: It's unnecessary -- Not so in Connecticut.

Per our Notary Public Handbook: "The person taking the oath holds up his right hand and the notary administers the oath". Ref: Section 4.8 Oaths and Affirmations. And, in Texas ....?

Reply by Marian_in_CA on 5/6/10 9:56pm
Msg #335355

For California...

It's optional. Per our handbook (v. 2010, page 12)


"When administering the oath, the signer and notary public traditionally each raise their right hand but this is not a legal requirement."

Reply by BrendaTx on 5/6/10 10:03pm
Msg #335358

John: I cannot find where it is said that Tx notaries

must require a hand to be raised. I've been wrong before, though.

http://www.sos.state.tx.us/statdoc/edinfo.shtml

Something about the oath and the hand was in the info awhile back, I could have sworn it said that it was the best practice to do so, but not required...but signers should be aware of the importance of the act.

Reply by Sylvia_FL on 5/6/10 10:11pm
Msg #335361

Re: John: I cannot find where it is said that Tx notaries

It isn't in the Texas handbook Brenda - so you are not wrong

But it does enforce the importance of the act.

Reply by Notarysigner on 5/7/10 12:27am
Msg #335370

Re: John: I cannot find where it is said that Tx notaries

It also grabs their attention!!

Reply by LC/AZ on 5/6/10 10:08pm
Msg #335360

After having them raise their right hand, I explain that....

there are certain documents within this loan packet that require a jurat and proceed to explain what a jurat is. Then, I ask them to choose if they prefer to be sworn in or affirmed. Most choose to be sworn in, so here's my speil for a swearing in: "Do you, Jack and Jill, solemnly swear, under oath, that the ids you presented to me and you are the same persons, and that any documents, within this loan packet, that say, sworn and subscribed , after reading the document and signing your name to it, you are attesting to the truth of the document, and if so, please state, "I do so swear."

Reply by Maureen_nh on 5/6/10 10:20pm
Msg #335364

Re: It's unnecessary

Gravitas, maybe not necessesary in some states but doesn't hurt.

Reply by Maureen_nh on 5/6/10 10:14pm
Msg #335363

Absolutely !!!

Reply by Susan Fischer on 5/6/10 11:49pm
Msg #335366

Yup, every jurat. I love taking oaths, it fills my

heart with assurances.

I look everyone in the eye, too. Down the pike, as they say. We're all on the same page.

Reply by JanetK_CA on 5/7/10 1:57am
Msg #335373

Re: Does anyone actually do the raised right hand? Yes!

I don't require it, but I automatically raise my own right hand and wait until they raise theirs or at least until I'm sure I have their attention. Every now and then someone will ask me about it or hesitate. I just tell them that it's not a requirement, but it IS tradition. That happened last week and the wife smiled, immediately raised her right hand up and said "I like tradition!"

Reply by TulsaNotary on 5/7/10 9:17am
Msg #335393

I do, too. Learned the importance from these forums. n/m

Reply by C. Rivera Chicago Notary Services on 5/7/10 10:29am
Msg #335407

YES. Its part of taking the oath.... n/m

Reply by Dave_CA on 5/7/10 10:58am
Msg #335411

Always.

Reply by RedBaron/IN on 5/7/10 4:30pm
Msg #335470

I always raise my right hand and look everyone in the eye that will be signing.

Reply by parkerc/ME on 5/7/10 4:50pm
Msg #335472

Only if I have to use the bathroom. n/m