Posted by Ali/IL on 5/25/10 10:49am
Msg #338017

legal or letter size

I don' t have a dual tray printer so I print on legal. Then print copies on letter size since it is cheaper.

But, I just received some docs from title company and they are all on letter size. Do any of you print the packages on letter size? I know that it depends on lender also.

Reply by oldhippie_IL on 5/25/10 10:53am
Msg #338020

I print what lenders ask. Some do want loans on letter. I NEVER print borrower's copies on letter.

Reply by C. Rivera Chicago Notary Services on 5/25/10 11:10am
Msg #338024

If the docs are formatted for legal, then I adjust my

printer so that it prints on legal. Though some lenders want both, which for me is a pain since I do not the actual dual tray for the dual tray HP work horse printer I got at a 2nd hand warehouse.

Otherwise, I print both copies on letter size paper.

For me, I'm trying to to green and using less paper is a start...

Reply by MW/VA on 5/25/10 11:14am
Msg #338027

Most common gripe in the industry is notaries printing

everything on letter-size. Going green is not an excuse for not doing the job properly.

Reply by C. Rivera Chicago Notary Services on 5/25/10 12:05pm
Msg #338038

if the lender is fine with it, then I'm printing on letter..

If that is a common 'gripe' against notaries that do, then call me Mrs. Gripe I'm saving paper and the environment.

Reply by Ilene C. Seidel on 5/25/10 12:54pm
Msg #338063

Re: Most common gripe in the industry is notaries printing

What if you or borrower make an error and need one of their copies to correct the problem the originals are on legal and borrowers on letter?? That doesn't work.

Reply by Notarysigner on 5/25/10 12:13pm
Msg #338041

Re: If the docs are formatted for legal, then I adjust my

Ok Cari..I have a dual tray printer and I don't have any problems with it but before I got it, this is what I did. No, it is not too time consuming or differ-cult.

I open the Doc and then preview them, basically scanning to see if anything is missing. While I do that, I have a piece of paper and I have two columns, one heading says letter the other says legal. As I scan the Docs I also write whether they're letter or legal.

You can print your docs appropriately with the information on your piece of paper. With your print set to legal, where it ask for what pages to print you a format it as follows. 1, 4-10, 13, 20 -29 and so on for all legal. Likewise for the letter Docs. You will be able to print what's desirable and make everybody happy.....until you get a dual tray printer.

Reply by Ali/IL on 5/25/10 12:44pm
Msg #338055

Re: If the docs are formatted for legal, then I adjust my

So, do you then put them back into the order they came in or does it matter?

Reply by Notarysigner on 5/25/10 12:49pm
Msg #338059

Re: If the docs are formatted for legal, then I adjust my

It depends on the client but I do have my own order also. Sort of like what's been mentioned here before, HUD, Note, TIL etc first.

Reply by Ali/IL on 5/25/10 12:50pm
Msg #338061

Re: If the docs are formatted for legal, then I adjust my

I have always printed on legal size.

Reply by Marian_in_CA on 5/25/10 2:53pm
Msg #338114

That's so expensive, though!

Always printing on legal increases your costs and can cause resource issues for others, too.

I have seen instructions that say to no print on all legal and if you do you'd not get paid.

One of the reasons for this has to do with DOTs... some county recorders require letter only, or they charge more for recording larger format documents. So, as an example... by printing on legal... you force somebody at the TC to spend extra time or resources trimming it down to size or forcing them to pay more for recording -- either way, increasing both YOUR costs and theirs -- and ultimately reducing their ability to pay.

Reply by JanetK_CA on 5/25/10 4:15pm
Msg #338151

Re: If the docs are formatted for legal, then I adjust my

I would recommend keeping them in order, just in case, as some lenders do want the docs kept in the same order. Before I got my dual tray, I used to do something similar, except that I didn't go all the way through every page. I did a compromise between all legal and all letter. As I would scan, I would look for stretches of docs that were all letter, then write down the page ranges.

Most of our County Recorders here want letter size, so I would always select the pages for the DOT and print those on letter; tax forms were another example. I would print in segments, then stack them in an offset way so I could easily put them together as they were and check them off as they were printed. (Hard to explain, but I had a system down that worked. It didn't eliminate all unnecessary use of legal size paper, but it did cut it down considerably.)

Having said that, I wish I had bought my dual tray sooner!! I'm using significantly less legal size paper - which is roughly twice as expensive as letter, most of the time. I'm all for going green, but I also don't recommend printing a page that was created legal size on letter size paper - even for the borrower's copies. Dual tray is a better way to go, imho.

Reply by C. Rivera Chicago Notary Services on 5/25/10 2:56pm
Msg #338115

yeah thanks Notarysigner, and again, I do print on both....

Like I wrote earlier, if the docs require to be printed on both letter and lega, no problem I can still do this w/out a dual tray, though it can be a pain. My wonderful printer knows when it needs to print on legal, so it grabs it from the pull out side feeder. Wonderful!

Reply by parkerc/ME on 5/25/10 6:06pm
Msg #338196

Re: If the docs are formatted for legal, then I adjust my

I do exactly the same as James, keep them in the order sent, and just flag with post-its the HUD-1, RTC, Note, Mtg/DOT, TIL, and Itemization. At the table, I pull out the flagged items one by one and put them back in their order after sigs, then go back to "Start" and finish with the remaining docs.

Reply by Marian_in_CA on 5/25/10 2:48pm
Msg #338111

The way I see it....

it's not our job to dictate paper size... just be prepared to print the files as they were prepared for us. We are hired with the expectation that we can accommodate their needs in an effective manor. If we want to be more profitable, we should invest in the equipment in that makes it easier for us to meet their needs, and frees up our time. If they prepared a mixture of legal and letter, that how they want it printed... that's how I print it.

Personally... if it were me, I'd do away with most of the paper documents entirely and get electronic signatures except for the most important few. We all know that 100 out of those 150 pages are totally useless garbage that nobody really caress about anyway, it's all just there for annoying compliance issues. Those items should be condensed down or combined.

I've seen some packages that have these nicely combined disclosure pages... reducing about 30 pages of "stuff" down to 2-3. Those are really nice.

Reply by Carmelina Carrillo on 6/20/13 2:27pm
Msg #474114

Re: If the docs are formatted for legal, then I adjust my

PDF IS IT LETTER OR LEGAL SIZE

Reply by MW/VA on 5/25/10 11:06am
Msg #338023

I have on tc that specifically requests all docs shrunk to letter size (go figure).
Otherwise, a dual-tray printer is worth the investment. I also never print borrowers copies of letter size. What do you do if you have to switch out for a mistake?

Reply by CopperheadVA on 5/25/10 11:12am
Msg #338026

Had one last night that specified that all docs were to be printed on letter size EXCEPT for the 1003, which was to be printed on legal size. The lender docs file was sent to me as a mixture of legal and letter sizes, and I had to shrink the legal size down to letter. Total of eight different attachments, too.

Reply by Linda Juenger on 5/25/10 11:24am
Msg #338030

I just can't comprehend not having the correct equipment to do your job correctly.   If I was the TC, I would not hire you unless you could print what the pkg requires.  What you are spending in buying all legal paper would pay for that 2nd tray in no time.   Take your job seriously and get what you need to perform your job correctly.  What other profession can you think of that doesn't have the right equipment, your doctor, your dentist, your electrician, your plumber, your carpenter etc etc etc .    There has been 2 times where I printed on all legal.  Both of those times were I was out and got called for a closing and I went to my sisters house instead of going all the way home to print.  She has a laser jet printer but only 1 tray.   I keep a ream of legal paper at her house for these occasions.   I've used hers 2x in the last year.  

Reply by Marian_in_CA on 5/25/10 11:36am
Msg #338031

Honestly... and I don't mean to sound harsh here...

But.... it will anyway I'm sure.

You're a business person -- get some proper office equipment that will accommodate your clients' needs. A good dual tray laser printer is not that expensive anymore, and VERY much worth it.

My current dual tray workhorse is a Brother 5250 DNT that I bought as a refurb on a sale for $199 about 2 years ago.

You can buy the same refurb'd model from Office Depot for $209.

I've NEVER had one problem with this printer, and it has paid for itself many times over.

See:

http://www.officedepot.com/a/products/438755/Brother-HL-5250DNT-Network-Monochrome-Laser/


Seriously... it's Memorial Day Weekend... there are TONS of sales right now, so it's a good time to start looking. If not the one I mention above, there are so many others out there right now.

Do yourself a favor... give yourself the capability to print with a dual tray.

Reply by Linda Juenger on 5/25/10 11:43am
Msg #338033

BINGO Marian, Thank you. n/m

Reply by Hugh Nations Signing Agents of Austin on 5/25/10 12:31pm
Msg #338048

Another view

In more than seven years as a signing agent, I cannot recall any client ever requiring of me that I print any part of a closing packet on letter-sized paper. I have, conversely, occasionally been instructed to print certain documents, notably deeds, on legal-sized paper.

I run three printers, with a fourth in reserve. None are dual-tray printers.

I pay approximately $43 for a case of legal size paper. Assuming that letter-sized paper costs me half that, and assuming that every closing requires 300 pages, I would save exactly 86 cents per closing if I printed **everything** on letter-sized paper, and commensurately less if only part of the packet was letter-sized. It would, in other words, take more than 250 closings to defray the investment in a $209 dual tray printer. And since I run only HP, the cost of the printer would be substantially higher than for a Brother, I suspect.

My judgment has been that I will invest in dual tray printers when my clients require it, or the economics of it are more attractive. The economics may be greatly different for someone who is a full-time signing agent, for but those of us are not, I don't think it reflects any lack of professionalism to reach a different conclusion.

Reply by Notarysigner on 5/25/10 12:39pm
Msg #338052

Re: Another view

I have two clients that request I print legal size only (last two years). The Docs that have to be recorded HERE must be letter size or there is a three dollar fee to shrink them to letter size. The clients just cut the legal size down to letter size.

Reply by LKT/CA on 5/25/10 1:13pm
Msg #338070

Re: Another view

<<<I have two clients that request I print legal size only (last two years)........The clients just cut the legal size down to letter size.>>>

I agree....I have clients that also specifically request legal size only. Also, I don't see why the pages could not be cut down as needed - the print is not in the middle of the page, it is at the top, fitting a letter size sheet so the empty bottom portion could be cut off.

To address the statements regarding the "correct equipment". You assume everyone's primary reason for receiving a commission was to become a SA. That could be true for those who live in states where 50 cents per notarization is all they can charge for general notarizations. I received my commission for the sole purpose of becoming a Notary. I never heard of the NNA until after I received my commission. I learned about loan signings during the 6 hour class. Completing loan signings is just icing on the cake. It was mentioned during the loan signing workshop I attended to buy a laser printer but there was no mention of a dual tray laser printer and the printer I owned before becoming a Notary was a small inkjet that served my needs just fine.

I hate to admit it but I am not tech savvy - probably due to my own laziness, so if it weren't for my 19 year old son.....I'd be lost when it comes to computers. The concept of a laser printer was quite foreign to me three years ago. Had I not become a Notary, I probably still would only have my little inkjet printer.

So I bought a single tray, multifunction laser printer. I now have two. I'm certain most would replace their single tray machine with a dual tray machine when it wears out, but a Notary is no less professional because they do not have a dual tray laser printer. I'm sure by the time I need to replace my machines, the world will be paperless.

Reply by JanetK_CA on 5/25/10 4:27pm
Msg #338157

Re: Another view

"I'm sure by the time I need to replace my machines, the world will be paperless."

Don't be so sure... I remember back in the 80's when we were talking about going paperless...

Reply by cadmonkey/CA on 5/25/10 1:05pm
Msg #338068

Re: Another view

for us full timers, a dual tray is all about saving time. When I get a package that has mixed sizes, I don't have to spend extra time sorting out the letter size sheets from the legal ones, then babysitting the entire print job and then piecing it all back in order. With a dual tray, it prints everything out and I'm good to go. More time = more signings = more $$$...

Reply by Marian_in_CA on 5/25/10 1:29pm
Msg #338077

Re: Another view

Agreed... it's a time thing, at least for me. I don't have time to fuss about about switching out paper. And, printing on all one size or another is not cost effective, either. It's also a bit annoying to say, "Oh, well... they can cut it down if they really want to, no big deal."

Have you ever sat and trimmed down 150 pieces of legal paper trying to get it to the perfect letter size? It's a needless waste of time and resources.

The way I see it, if a page in a file is prepared in such a way that it is a legal size paper, than that's what it gets printed on - same with letter -- unless my directions say otherwise. And a proper dual tray eliminates all the hassle with that -- just hit print, and off it goes.

I've only received three packages where I was told to only print on one size or another. The rest have all been a mixture of legal and letter.

Personally... yeah.... I'd live to see legal size done away with. It's annoying.

Reply by LKT/CA on 5/25/10 4:23pm
Msg #338156

Re: Another view

<<<Have you ever sat and trimmed down 150 pieces of legal paper trying to get it to the perfect letter size? It's a needless waste of time and resources.>>>

You must be thinking of a pair of scissors. Businesses use a paper cutter, which takes *seconds* to cut a stack of paper down to letter (or any) size. In my old job as an executive assistant, when I hand created invitations, made flyers, memos, etc., I had to cut ribbons, various qualities and thicknesses of paper, misc. items of all kinds. Just set the parameters, put paper (or whatever) against edge, lift blade arm, and SLICE. That thing was so sharp it could cut off a hand. It was a godsend.

Reply by jba/fl on 5/25/10 10:20pm
Msg #338260

Re: Another view

"That thing was so sharp it could cut off a hand. It was a godsend."

How many hands did you have to or get to cut off during ths stint?

OMG - I have had such a rotten day, my mind is going down strange avenues. Thanks for the great visual. ROFL

Reply by cadmonkey/CA on 5/25/10 12:59pm
Msg #338065

Re: BINGO Marian, Thank you.

better yet, get two of the same dual tray printer, that way you can print borrower sets at the same time and you have a spare backup printer as well. And ordering toner carts and maintenance kits is also simplified. I have two hp 4200's I got off craigslist for unbelievable prices and they have been as solid as tanks...

Reply by Robert/FL on 5/25/10 12:30pm
Msg #338047

I say get rid of legal size period

The only benefit to legal size is if you have a document that will be recorded, such as a deed, and it is just a little too long to fit on a letter size; in that case it is better to do it on legal because then you only have to pay to record one page versus two letter-size pages.

But, it's a pain in the butt to store legal-size files, pain to scan, pain to fax, etc.

Reply by Ali/IL on 5/25/10 12:49pm
Msg #338058

Re: I say get rid of legal size period

Oh gee sometimes makes you wonder if you should even ask a question

Reply by bagger on 5/25/10 1:46pm
Msg #338087

Re: I say get rid of legal size period

LOL Ali, there are some HUGE, and I do mean HUGE ego's here.

Reply by Ali/IL on 5/25/10 2:12pm
Msg #338099

Re: I say get rid of legal size period

Oh my goodness tell me about it. I have been a notary signing agent on here for over five years. I sometimes see a post start here and say oh boy here we go!

Anyway, I appreciate you all. The best to all of you. We are here to help each other not to attack.

I have seen some threads started about something that has nothing to do with our work and do just fine. But, some threads about our work get so shot down.

Reply by MW/VA on 5/25/10 3:03pm
Msg #338119

Re: I say get rid of legal size period

I've even heard from a paper dealer that the industry wants to stop mfg. legal-size paper.
Lots of luck on that. In our industry, we print according to what they require--it's not our call to make. As far as I know, our printing requirements are either dual tray or print on all legal.
I hear of notaries all the time that print everything on all letter-size and even use ink jet printers.
That's not what the industry requires.

Reply by Larry/IL on 5/25/10 1:02pm
Msg #338066

Ali, I read your post & some of the replies. I noticed some of the replies did not even answer your question, "Do any of you print the packages on letter size?" Let me first share what I experience, I always follow what the Lender or title company request in regards to paper size. I found there is absolutely no consistency. I have had different title companies ask for letter only, legal only, and a mix of both (print from PDF source), funny thing is these scenarios could all be for the same lender. There are no set rules, and they seem to change all the time, it's just best to follow what they ask for. I almost always print the copies on letter to save on paper and have only ran into one T/C that would rather I print copies as the originals.

I read some of the other replies to your post. I would take what some say with a grain of salt. One started by saying they didn't want to sound harsh, another couldn't comprehend, funny how neither answered your question or shared their experience. There are part time NSAs, NSAs that would like to think they are professional & Full Time professional NSAs alike that share this site. Each level of NSA has an OPINION on what is the the proper equipment do a professional job. In reality the only equipment that is needed is what can accommodate the Lender or T/C's request. Some NSA have monetary budgets & limitations, some do not.

I believe as long as the printer you have is Laser, can print both letter and legal, then you could get the job done and still fulfill the lender's requirements. Now whether you desire two or three printers with the bells and whistles depends what level you desire or can afford to be at. I do quite a few appointments every month and sometimes very very close together time wise. I aspire to stay full time and to offer service that a lot of other NSAs cannot compete with. I use two printers in my office, a 3 year old Dual Tray Brother 8640n that prints 30ppm & a Brother 5470DWT, also 30ppm. I just got the message to replace the fuser on the 8460. I thought I was going to have to throw it away till I found a new fuser on ebay for $108. I checked and I have now printed over 101,000 pages on the 8640. When I do not buy enough toner to do my own refills, ($20-$30 for enough for 5 refills, 8,500 pages), I buy from LD products. You would not be sorry for investing in a similar dual tray printer.

I can print those 175 page BOA packages with copies (350 pages) in about 15 minutes and be running. Believe me when I say I get many calls for an emergencies when another notary didn't show and I can name my price (not gouging of course). I have taken it one step further, I have a laptop in the car with another dual tray 5470DWT. I will sometimes get calls directly from lenders asking me, what I would charge to help them in a jam. Sometimes even after quoting double my xxx fee they say they are calling the T/C to put me on it. I wouldn't feel I was true professional if I had to run to a family member's home to print my documents.

Ali, so you see there are many different levels of NSA and they all have varying opinions. I just wanted to reply to let you know, I read an actually read & COMPREHENDED your question. I wanted to share so that some of us NSAs might help each other. I thought that was suppose to be what this site was for? Hope I helped Ali.

P.S. I hope none of this sounded too HARSH.

Reply by cadmonkey/CA on 5/25/10 1:10pm
Msg #338069

Larry, you are a true pro! n/m

Reply by LKT/CA on 5/25/10 1:21pm
Msg #338072

<<<I don' t have a dual tray printer so I print on legal. Then print copies on letter size since it is cheaper. But, I just received some docs from title company and they are all on letter size. Do any of you print the packages on letter size? I know that it depends on lender also.>>>

I also only have single tray laser printers and typically print all legal in the absence of instructions. Call the TC and ask if they want the docs printed on all letter. It may have been scanned to letter but they'd rather have docs printed to legal. When a TC wants docs printed on all letter (only had this happen once) there were explicit instructions to print on all letter.

It won't hurt to make a phone call for clarification.

Reply by Shauna/WA on 5/25/10 2:23pm
Msg #338102

Re: legal or letter size/Printer options

Ali, I bought a nice dual tray HP off of Craigslist. Total cost was $40. I tested it out before I bought it. For the cost it was the single best purchase I've made in regards to my notary career. I can print an entire loan package in 10 minutes, absolute max. Doing the borrower's copy is equally as nice.

If your craigslist is active, definitely look on there. If anyone in SW Washington/Portland OR area needs a good dual tray that needs about $50 worth of work I have one of those, too. The Craigslist seller threw it in with the one I use now for free. I'd happily give it away.

Reply by Marian_in_CA on 5/25/10 2:37pm
Msg #338109

After reading this again...

I totally misread the OP. I fully admit it.

I've only had one request for all letter size paper. For me, I didn't even think about it, though... that's what a dual tray is for. I admit it was really nice, though -- I'm not a fan of legal sized paper, but... it's use is so common, it doesn't exactly bother me either.

That said... I still advocate the use of a dual tray for any notary doing loan work. It just reduces your effort by leaps and bounds. For awhile, I didn't have one, either, thought I was fine without. But once I got one, I seriously called myself a big doofus for not doing it sooner. It has saved me HOURS and HOURS of extra effort and made life so much easier.

Reply by rengel/CA on 5/25/10 4:39pm
Msg #338164

Working in the legal field for the past 8 yrs.....

and having filed in every court in the State of California, i.e. state, federal, bankruptcy, family, appellate, etc, I have NEVER filed anything on "legal" sized paper. I'm thinking that the financial world is the only one who utilizes legal size paper anymore.

My .02