Posted by Marian_in_CA on 9/5/10 12:50am
Msg #351603

Apalling service charges...

I was called to the hospital tonight for a routine Advance Healthcare Directive notarization. I'm there a lot for that kind of thing. I'm on a list with several other mobile notaries in the area that the hospital gives out to patients.

Well, tonight, I found out that one of the "people" on the list isn't a Notary at all, but a Signing Service -- and they quoted these people $99.00 + $10 a signature. This is just general notary work... one notarized signature! $99???

I charge $30.00 to go to that hospital - $20.00 travel, plus $10.00 per signature. If there are multiple signatures, I usually do them gratis, or prorate the per signature fee. So, if there are two, I drop the per sig fee to $5.00. I'm too generous that way... but when it comes to people in the hospital, nursing home or senior citizens... the business side of me tends to take a back seat. Plus, I know that my community is not exactly a wealthy one... you have to set the fees that your market is willing to pay.

I was astonished that this service quoted them $99.00 just for travel. Obviously, the service is taking a nice cut of that. But that's a ridiculous fee to be charging people in my community... especially when there are at least 10 mobile notaries willing to travel there without the help of a service.

Now, if it's really late at night, usually between 11pm and 7am, I'll up the travel fee to $30.00. Nobody is really bothered by that... they know getting somebody that late will come at a premium... but $99? I could not, in any kind of good conscience charge that much for a 15-20 minute appointment at a hospital.

Even worse???? This service CHARGES its notaries $50-$199/year to be in their directory. Not that I'd ever consider joining it.... I'm just amazed.

Fortunately, the lady that called me tonight said that when they quoted that to her, she just hung up on them without a word. She knew it was outrageous.

Reply by James Dawson on 9/5/10 10:33am
Msg #351611

That is just plain ridiculous to charge that much but then again, whoever is charging that amount probably doesn't plan on becoming a senior themselves!

Reply by Roger_OH on 9/5/10 11:08am
Msg #351613

Re: Appalling service charges...

I'd mention the ridiculous rates to the hospital's social services department, who has likely prepared the referral list. I can't imagine that they'd want their patients subjected to that.

I get a lot of calls to health facilities, and if I can't do it, will refer it to a local colleague.

Reply by MW/VA on 9/5/10 11:40am
Msg #351616

I agree that general notary work should never be handled by an ss. I ran into that situation once, where the client had obviously ended up with an ss when they did their search. It was a shame to see them pay that ridiculous fee. I decided that if I ever run into that again I'm not going to do it.

Reply by Cari on 9/5/10 1:50pm
Msg #351624

I look at it like this....I run a biz, and I have to pay bills and feed my family as well. And I really do not feel guilty about charging the fees that I charge. They are, for me, reasonable, and fit my needs. I'm also self-employed, and not necessarily by choice, but mainly out of necessity.

I do offer discounts and will provide free services to those that simply state they can't afford my fees, but that's on a per case basis.

The SS is going to charge what they charge so they can make money. Plain and simple. Plus they have to pay the notary a fee for the job as well. IMO, its all business, just like any other business.

And if notaries want to spend ridiculous amounts of $ on notary directories, or any other service to 'pay for work', so bit it...I say, to each their own.

Personally, I'm tired of blasting those for accepting low nsa fees or the like, because in the end, its none of my business, or anyone else's, plain and simple. And it doesn't really matter because the folks are going to do what they need to do, to survive.

IMO, and no disrespect intended, but you're wasting your breath by blasting others regarding this particular issue.

Reply by Bob_Chicago on 9/5/10 5:15pm
Msg #351640

I seriously question if a signing service can legally charge

for the service of providing a notary for general notary work.
I also question the charging of anything for service fees, late hour fees, inconvenient (dangerous) location fees or any other "fees" beyond stautorally allowed travel and
per signature/stamp fees for general notary work.
NSA work involves printing, messenger, shipping, supervision signing of non notarized dox,
and is not ( and I hope never will be ) the subject of government regulation.

Reply by Bob_Chicago on 9/5/10 5:16pm
Msg #351641

This was supposed to go under the OP. n/m

Reply by Marian_in_CA on 9/5/10 6:17pm
Msg #351646

Re: I seriously question if a signing service can legally charge

California does not regulate fees outside of notarial acts... mobile notaries are free to charge additional fees, as long as they properly account for them on their invoices/invoices. These fees can include printing, messaging, shipping, copying, etc. We are also free to charge by the hour for mobile services if we choose.

For example, if I go to jail or a courthouse, I charge by the hour for my time and all notarizations and other tasks are free.

For general notary work, I usually charge a travel fee plus a per signature fee. Often, I will adjust those fees based on the situation. Example: If I'm asked to go to the Veteran's Home, I do not charge at all if the notarization is for one of the residents. I also provide free notarizations once every two weeks at an assisted living facility. I'm on their calendar and I spend about 2 hours there. That's a very popular service... and I take with me cards of estate and elder law attorneys, and other services in case I need to refer -- and I often do!

I have no issue with other notaries charging what they need to make a profit.. I'm all for that. If I come in higher or lower than them, I'm fine either way. But, sometimes... the fee is so obviously ridiculous. I know that some of the mobile notaries in my area charge a flat fee of $50-65 and everything is included. Others only charge $10 and waive the travel fee.

I've been known to waive or reduce the travel fee based on the situation. But, in general... if I'm called to that hospital... it's $30. I have several reasons for that... one is that it's a bit of a nightmare dealing with their security sometimes. Another is that there is absolutely no parking available there most of the time. I usually have to park about 1/4 mile away and hoof it.

I've found that most people ask me my fee, and when I tell them... they eagerly ask me to come. I'm usually the cheapest one they've called. To me, $30 is a fair price for the convenience, and still within my profit margin. My husband calls it the "pizza rule" -- figure that, in our community, they'd be willing to pay about what it would cost to have a couple of pizzas delivered.

If I'm too expensive, I always give them a name or two of other notaries that might be willing to do it for less. For non-hospital jobs, if they don't want to pay for me... that's cool. I know that mobile service is a convenience/luxury, and that not everyone can afford it.

I'll happily refer them to the AAA office, or one of two pack-n-ship stores that I know have decent notaries on staff. In those cases, I always tell them that if they walk in to the notary's office... they need to make sure that they see the posted notary rates somewhere and that they know they can't be charged more than $10 per signature. Unless, of course... they need something extra, like copies made. Those are not notarial fees, so they can be charged for that.

Reply by James Dawson on 9/5/10 6:27pm
Msg #351647

Ditto! I do go a lttle higher but that's

because of bridge tolls and parking fees if they don't accommodate vendors.

Reply by Marian_in_CA on 9/5/10 6:52pm
Msg #351652

Re: Ditto! I do go a lttle higher but that's

Same here... though in my area we don't deal with many tolls or paid parking. It's an area with a lot of military and retired aerospace workers. It's not a wealthy community by any means... so it's like I said... it pays to know your market.

I do charge more depending on distance... and out where I live, distance can be a HUGE factor. But, it's also usually wide open desert roads.

I initially charged a bit more when I first got here... but I quickly learned that my fees were too high for what people were willing to pay. So, I did a little bit of number crunching, and I found rates that still fell within my profit margin but were more along the lines people were willing to pay. It worked... and the calls for general work are very steady now.

Now, with loan packages... that's a bit different. I'm not as willing to lower me fees to make a signing service happy. As I've said before, loan work is much more involved and my costs are higher. I am happy to negotiate fees for each situation, but I'm not working for free, either. Fortunately, the TC/Escrow companies who hire me directly understand that. It's the signing services that don't.

My favorite is when a SS gets upset that I charge additional mileage to go out to the middle of nowhere, for example. They always say the same thing, "But it's in your same zip code!"

And I always tell them the same thing... zip code searches mean nothing. The zip code I live in covers 250 square miles...including a portion of Edwards AFB that is off-limits... and the most populated area is on the very western edge of that zip code, including where I live. They usually don't grasp the fact that zip code searches look from the geographic center of a zip code, so I often appear to be 14-15 miles away, when I might just be down the street.

Reply by James Dawson on 9/5/10 8:18pm
Msg #351673

Re: Ditto! I do go a lttle higher but that's

Yes, like San Francisco is only six miles away but between 4 - 6 , 1 1/2 hours in traffic.

Reply by Cari on 9/6/10 8:12pm
Msg #351720

Bob, SS hire notarys to perform non nsa work all the time..

an example would be to verify, obtain and notarizing sigs for debt settlement documents, etc.

The notary gets paid for their time, print and travel fees...similar but very different the duties of the nsa...

Notaries also get hired by lawfirms to obtain signatures on legal documents, and/or or to swear in their clients for court, etc.

Not sure why you would doubt whether or not a SS can legally charge for providing notary publics for their clients as some are not limited by ONLY providing its clients with NSA's?

Reply by SharonMN on 9/7/10 10:30am
Msg #351741

OK, I'm going to differ from the crowd here. Any service person such as a plumber or appliance repair guy is going to charge at least $99 just to show up, and that's if you can get them to show up in the evening at all. And they expect to make another couple hundred fixing whatever it is that needs to be fixed. So I don't think $99 is outrageous to ask for a mobile notary call charge, although most people can and do find a much cheaper way to get their notarizations done - e.g. at the bank, UPS store, grocery store, etc., and won't pay that much. I don't do any general notary work, because the price the market will bear isn't enough for me to be able to make any money on it. (We get $1 per signature in MN, and no one wants to pay a $50+ travel fee when they can go to the bank for $1.)