Posted by TinaCA on 4/15/11 8:58am
Msg #379869
Dishonest Notories
I was at a borrowers home on Wed for a refinance. As we were talking, she told me that a notary that was at her home on Monday, asked her if she could forge her boyfriends name as a second witness. The borrower said yes and proceeded to do so, her boyfriend then walked in and told her that was a pretty good forgery. Can you believe this?
| Reply by Linda_H/FL on 4/15/11 9:02am
Msg #379870
And you went along with it??? n/m
| Reply by Linda_H/FL on 4/15/11 9:03am
Msg #379871
I apologize...I misread....so sorry...:( n/m
| Reply by James Dawson on 4/15/11 9:15am
Msg #379874
This is not meant to be an attack on you Tina but......So now that YOU know this and telling us, where do you plan to go with it? That would be my question. If it were me, and they admitted before me it was a forgery, I would first of all have nothing to do with it and explained why to the hiring party. Wouldn't that make you liable (specially if you notarized a Jurat)?
| Reply by A S Johnson on 4/15/11 9:32am
Msg #379877
James, reporting this to the ss, where is this going to get you????
Yes, report it to the SOS office, it's a "he said, she said".
NO! I don't like not being reporting the person committing the FRAUD or the ss-title/escrow cos, lenders of turning a "blind eye" BUT, again, it's becomes a he "said, she said".
Beleive me, I've tried and I'm the one who lost.
| Reply by Linda Juenger on 4/15/11 9:37am
Msg #379879
James, Read the op again. Tina had nothing to do with it.
I had to read it a couple times also to understand it fully and make sure that Tina was not the one doing this, BUT another Notary.
| Reply by James Dawson on 4/15/11 9:54am
Msg #379880
Two things...I just asked where was she going with it
..NO ACCUSATIONS at all....for A.S. The he said/she said part is written by the O.P. For Linda, I understood what she wrote. But there are questions, was she redoing it or 'continuing the process, that's not mentioned.
If the signing was canceled on "Monday" and she was re-doing it than yes, the notary on "Monday" is stupid considering they were committing a felony. CA notary handbook 2011 pages 17, 30, 32, 33 (l) and 37 makes that clear.
Tina, I write lot's of post that are mis-understood so please, my question was to assure you are covering yourself from possible harm.
| Reply by C. Rivera Chicago Notary Services on 4/15/11 10:19am
Msg #379886
Re: Two things...I just asked where was she going with it
One can only assume that the reason why the OP services were needed was due to the first notary screwing up mighty badly...
Would've been "interesting" to see WHO that other notary was? Can I convince you to post his/her name??
| Reply by MW/VA on 4/15/11 10:16am
Msg #379884
Why wouldn't you report them to the CA SOS? n/m
| Reply by rengel/CA on 4/15/11 10:50am
Msg #379893
What would she report?
Tina has NO proof that a forgery actually occurred, as she did not witness it happening. What she would be reporting is considered "hearsay" in the legal world and not admissible.
My .02
| Reply by James Dawson on 4/15/11 11:18am
Msg #379899
Re: Why wouldn't you report them to the CA SOS?
It would be up to the SOS to investigate, who knows maybe there are "other" complaints.
It would help of course if the Doc in question was available to present.
Reason to investigate???? Here's a few....but it's up to the state.
There's the borrower, the boyfriend and the two notaries, certainly something a phone interview could accommodate.
1. executing a false certificate (l) Execution of any certificate as a notary public containing a statement known to the notary public to be false.
§ 8214.2. Fraud relating to deed of trust; single-family residence; felony
(a) A notary public who knowingly and willfully with intent to defraud performs any notarial
act in relation to a deed of trust on real property consisting of a single-family residence
containing not more than four dwelling units, with knowledge that the deed of trust contains
any false statements or is forged, in whole or in part, is guilty of a felony.
(b) The penalty provided by this section is not an exclusive remedy and does not affect any
other relief or remedy provided by law.
§ 8227.3. Unlawful acts by one not a notary public; deeds of trust on single-family
residences; felony
Any person who is not a duly commissioned, qualified, and acting notary public who does
any of the acts prohibited by Section 8227.1 in relation to any document or instrument affecting
title to, placing an encumbrance on, or placing an interest secured by a mortgage or deed of
trust on, real property consisting of a single-family residence containing not more than four
dwelling units, is guilty of a felony.
§ 115.5. Filing false or forged documents relating to single-family residences;
punishment; false statement to notary public
(a) Every person who files any false or forged document or instrument with the county
recorder which affects title to, places an encumbrance on, or places an interest secured by a
mortgage or deed of trust on, real property consisting of a single-family residence containing
not more than four dwelling units, with knowledge that the document is false or forged, is
punishable, in addition to any other punishment, by a fine not exceeding seventy-five thousand
dollars ($75,000).
| Reply by bagger on 4/15/11 12:24pm
Msg #379914
Re: Why wouldn't you report them to the CA SOS?
IMHO, you have a moral obligation to report this.
If you KNOW that some one is committing a crime, and you DO NOT report it, you are almost as guilty as the person who committed the crime.
It is not your responsiblility to investigate, but it is your responsibility to tip off the investigator's. This is your business, and if your competitor's are doing something blatantly illegal it is your duty to report it.
Remember --- If you are not part of the cure, then you are part of the problem.
FIX IT
| Reply by Linda_H/FL on 4/15/11 5:14pm
Msg #379987
Well, mostly she wouldn't report to CA SOS
because she's in CT....
And I wonder if the SOS would take the complaint from her or would they require it be filed by the signers who she said it to...
Just a thought.
| Reply by James Dawson on 4/15/11 6:47pm
Msg #380009
Re: Well, mostly she wouldn't report to CA SOS
i FOUND OUT the SOS 'S possession it that 'complaints" must be file by the "harmed" individual and not someone on thd sidelines.
| Reply by James Dawson on 4/15/11 6:48pm
Msg #380010
meant to say position n/m
| Reply by Stephanie_CA on 4/15/11 3:12pm
Msg #379962
Tina, you politely end the signing and
leave the premises.
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