Posted by NewPhoenix on 4/12/11 2:16pm
Msg #379518

Gripe, grumble, grouse...

Just had a well known title company lie to me outright. They asked me to do a last minute signing yesterday over 30 miles from me. Instructions from LENDER said to fax signature pages ONLY back to them. so I did that last night, 15 pages, confirmed receipt. Title calls today and said lender only got signature pages and the first and signature page of Note and why didn't I fax to them? (Title). I said I followed the instructions. They said the Lender wanted to see the whole package, or at least all pages of the Note. I had not dropped it yet so I faxed the whole Note to title. I already knew I should have told them I dropped the package because I knew what was coming. So now she calls back and claims the lender did not receive ANY of the pages and she wants the whole packages (all pages!!!) faxed to them (Title). I asked her which pages and she proceeded to name ALL of the documents, ALL pages! I let her know that I was not happy with that and went ahead and did it anyway (or I'm sure they would not pay me otherwise).
So she lied to me about the lender not receiving any of the pages just because THEY (Title) wanted to see the entire package. Her first call told me the Lender only received the signature pages, now it was they received none! Yeah right.
Yeah I'm PO'd. I'll bet they try to short my on the fee, after driving over 60 miles RT, last minute and made me late for my next appointment.

Reply by SOCAL/CA on 4/12/11 2:25pm
Msg #379521

It's important to get all instructions in writing. Send them an email confirming the phone conversation and ask for a response.

Reply by Moneyman/TX on 4/12/11 2:54pm
Msg #379522

This is an example of why I now only scan and email "fax backs" to companies. I started that nearly 2 years ago after I faxed back several pages and had a company call me after the package was dropped to say they were "missing" a page (like page 11 out of 20). Like you, my confirmation showed that all pages were faxed. I told them they would have the entire package the next morning and I could not do anything about the supposed missed page at that point.

Since I began scanning them in and emailing them I have not had one company claim they were missing anything. If they ever did, I would be able to just resend the email for them after I have dropped the package.

If you have the capabilities of scanning the docs in, it might be an option you can consider for future "fax back" orders. As a side note, I also charge for fax back (or email back) doc services as well.

Reply by parkerc/ME on 4/12/11 4:47pm
Msg #379539

Same here. I'm doing the same as Chris, if fax-backs are required, I scan and email. Eliminates the risk of having my fax transmission dropped or interrupted.

Reply by Glenn Strickler on 4/13/11 1:53pm
Msg #379638

Ditto. If you don't have a scanner, then fax them

to the fax number that is included in your NotRot membership, download the pdf and email that. I did that a couple of times when my scanner broke.

Reply by LKT/CA on 4/12/11 5:31pm
Msg #379550

<<<So she lied to me about the lender not receiving any of the pages just because THEY (Title) wanted to see the entire package. Her first call told me the Lender only received the signature pages, now it was they received none! Yeah right. Yeah I'm PO'd. I'll bet they try to short my on the fee, after driving over 60 miles RT, last minute and made me late for my next appointment.>>>

When you accepted the signing, it would have been a good idea to fax/email a fee schedule. This way you could have informed the scheduler that the fee you agreed to was based on faxing back only the signature pages. If the TC wants the entire package faxed back then the amount on your fee schedule applies and a NEW CONFIRMATION reflecting the new fee must be emailed to you before you'll fax the entire package.

Never let unplanned (and unpaid for) changes from one appointment make you late for another appointment.

Reply by NewPhoenix on 4/12/11 11:23pm
Msg #379571

Gripe, grumble, grouse...

Thanks for the replies folks! I see two things common to them:
1. Yes I know about scan/email documents. It takes about three times longer overall to SCAN the pages (about 50 seconds per page) and store them. Then I have to open the email, select Attach Files, click on Browse and open the directory, go down and find the page, click Open and wait about 20 seconds for it to attach. Do that times 10 - 20 pages, so about 15 - 20 minutes for 10 - 12 typical pages vs 4-6 minutes to fax.
2. I can't tell the title company that I am going to charge a higher fee than we have already negotiated. They have already said the maximum they will pay (or else they will call someone else - and they WILL). And then they would never call me again and none of us can afford that these days. If they don't meet my minimum when they first call I turn them down right then and that hurts bad enough. But I don't want the GOOD ones to stop calling me.
Today I called and increased my "base fee" for my best title company by $10 due to gas increases and she was HORRIFIED. She said outright: "That's more than our base amount, you won't get any calls because another notary will take less than you".
Any time I get a call from title/SS and after they tell me the fee I ask if there are any fax backs. If they say yes then I at least try and say I want to add more for faxbacks they always say "$xx is the most we can pay. If you can't do it for that we will call someone else". So insisting to add MORE for faxing is NOT an option, maybe at one time but not any more. I wish we COULD set our own fees ans still stay in business lol. But as we know, there are always a dozen others willing to do it for less, whether they are actually losing money or not.

Reply by Art_MD on 4/13/11 8:58am
Msg #379592

time to scan

I don't know what scanner you use, but I use an inexpensive Multi-function (brother 240C). You can set density, format (gif, pdf, jpeg etc), doc size etc. Can have 4 different sets of options. I have 1 set at 150 dpi, legal, pdf. Another is 150 dpi, letter pdf. Can scan from auto doc feeder. Can set to ask for file name. Takes 30 sec for 10 pages.

You might not be using the full capabilities of your scanner.


Art

Reply by Art_MD on 4/13/11 9:52am
Msg #379594

Re: time to scan actual

Just did a LARGE fax back. 8 legal, 40 letter. scanned to 3 files legal - 1 file, letter 2 files.

Total time start to finish 7 minutes.

Art

Reply by Moneyman/TX on 4/14/11 12:28pm
Msg #379769

Re: #1 - Check the settings on your fax. The higher the settings the slower the scan. I normally use 300 x 300 with no real issues as far as time is concerned. Another cause of additional time may be "system clutter" in your computer. Try cleaning it out as well.

Re: #2: Fax backs ARE an additional service and you have to decide if you want to charge for the time involved and the service. If you do, charge it from the start (within the quote). If they state that "there may be fax backs" then charge as if there will be. The person calling you about the assignment doesn't call you for free (i.e. they want to get paid for their time) so they have no right to ask you to work for free.

The "max" they will pay should have nothing to do with what you feel is a correct amount you should charge for your time and services. Do you get to tell your plumber what you will pay for his extra services? How about an attorney? Or any other professional?

If you include fax back service for free, then you really cannot complain about "having to do it". It is your business, treat it as such. Don't let your customers set your prices. Doing that will put you out of business.

Reply by ReneeK_MI on 4/13/11 5:06am
Msg #379585

this leaves me with a couple questions

Title was the one who hired you, right? Did Title ask in advance for fax-backs, and was their request explicit? I ask because I'm confused as to why you'd follow Lender's instructions for that, as opposed to the one who hired you.

FWIW, whenever faxing a Note - I send it all. For the DOT/MTG, usually first/signature & notarial cert will do, but again ...depends on hiring party's direction.

Lastly ...was this a purchase or a N/O/O refi? That in itself would explain Title's need, frustration and their 'overkill' the next day.

Reply by NewPhoenix on 4/13/11 11:57am
Msg #379611

this leaves me with a couple questions

This was some kind of auto loan at their home, not the dealership. There was the usual "fax may be required" in the initial request email but no mention after that from title. The only explicit request was in the Lender's instructions for signature pages only which I took to be the "may be required". The loan was six pages - one of those where the signature page was the second page so I sent the first two.

Well then here comes the title suddenly griping at ME because I did not fax the whole package to THEM. They said the lender got the signature pages but they wanted the other four pages of the Loan doc (so I know they got the rest) and would I fax the whole loan doc to them (title)? Well, I SHOULD have told them I already dropped the package, that would have been the end of it. But no, I faxed it to them.

NOW they call back and say (no surprise) "Oh, the Lender did not get ANY pages so would I fax the rest of the package?" I asked which pages and she proceeded to name ALL the documents in the package, INCLUDING all the unsigned credit report pages and Letter to New Customer garbage and everything else.

It just p'd me off that once they knew I still had the package (it was a late signing) they LIED to me and claimed the lender never got the original fax - just because THEY wanted a copy of the package.

Reply by parkerc/ME on 4/13/11 1:57pm
Msg #379639

If title hired me and docs are going back to ..

title and there were no instructions from them to fax anything, that's what I adhere to. If somewhere in the lender instructions is a requirement for fax backs to lender, I leave that to title to do.