Posted by BrendaTx on 12/3/11 6:48pm
Msg #405697

Regarding CJ's Thoughts on Invalid ID Msg #405615

Msg #405615

CJ writes:

Today, I signed a guy who works for the District Attorney. >>>Part of his job is to arrest notaries. <<<We got talking about invalid IDs, and he explained that if the notary DOES sign someone using improper ID,>>> not only is the notary arrested, but the signers are arrested too because they agreed to use the improper ID. This is “conspiracy to commit a crime”, which is ALWAYS a felony<<<<. So next time they are leaning on you to break the law for their convenience, let them know that if they do that, they are risking jail as well.

=================================

I would like the opportunity to contact this man. I know you cannot give me his name because he is a client, but wow...inquiring minds want to know!!

I am almost certain that policemen or sheriff personnel do not work for District Attorneys' offices. They work for either a city or a county, respectively. Is this different in California?

In what area(s) of California have outlaw notary cases been assigned to units?

This is all very interesting. I would like to see just one case that this guy has handled in the fashion he described to you. I'm skeptical of his story.

Reply by Hugh Nations Signing Agents of Austin on 12/3/11 7:02pm
Msg #405698

I concur, Brenda

I'd be willing to bet the next bouquet of roses I send to my ex-wife that there is no designated Notaries-as-Felons unit in any DA's office in the country. The best that might have happened, I suspect, is that there was a notary involved in a case that the ADA was assigned.

And, just to clarify, that's the next bouquet I send to my <last> ex-wife. Those are rather small ones.

Reply by FlaNotary2 on 12/3/11 7:25pm
Msg #405700

I agree, Brenda

I doubt that the state attorney - in California or any other jurisdiction - has that much time on their hands that they are prosecuting notaries. Not to say they shouldn't, because I think notaries SHOULD be prosecuted when they commit fraud, but I too am skeptical of CJ's story (not that I don't believe CJ - I just don't believe the attorney).

I have only heard of one notary in Florida being arrested - and it was for issuance of a false notarial certificate (third-degree felony). Of course, this happens all the time... I have just only heard of one instance of the notary being arrested.

Reply by GOLDGIRL/CA on 12/3/11 7:31pm
Msg #405701

I was wondering the same thing, Brenda. My thoughts were that the DA had some mortgage fraud investigative unit and then told whoever to go arrest the bad guys, who usually include a notary. Still, I have not heard of any arrests along this line in my neck of the woods.

Also, if they arrested every notary in CA who accepted invalid/improper/whatever ID, they'd have to book every escrow officer up and down the state. These escrow/title notaries couldn't care less about ID and take anything, which is why we're left holding the bag at refi time when so-and-so who has taken title in a name for which they never did and still don't have ID is ticked because we don't roll over like escrow did... using the oft-heard line: "Well, this has never been a problem before ....." (Well, it's a problem now...)

So, I think the guy whose job "is to arrest notaries" focuses on the fraud cases. Nonetheless, it's somewhat reassuring to know that ID issues are actually on someone's radar.

Reply by BrendaTx on 12/4/11 9:31am
Msg #405718

Let me explain where I am coming from...

If policemen are trying to catch up with notaries who are not operating properly during loan signings, they will not say that they are out there arresting notaries...they will just continue to watch and gather intel.

I just received a PM from a friend who said that she once finished a signing with a policeman present (as if an LO) and he showed his badge and said, "Aren't you glad you gave the oath?"

What??!!

What good is it to intimidate notaries who are acting properly? Do they really want to flash a badge and insinuate that they are on a hunt for notaries who are not giving oaths? Doesn't that kind of blow the "loan officer" cover story?

This makes no sense...I obviously do not have all the facts, but I sure would like to. I have a selfish interest in this. If it is actually true that this much law enforcement attention to notary behavior is being given now, then I want to get the facts on it. This is huge and should be shared nationwide.

If I could get just one arrest report that says that a notary was arrested for not giving an oath, or for accepting invalid ID in any state I would be very, very happy. I'm going to start looking for these right now.

I don't know about CA, but I believe that if a notary was arrested in Texas for not giving an oath, or accepting an invalid ID, it would make headlines.

Reply by Notarysigner on 12/4/11 10:25am
Msg #405719

Re: Let me explain where I am coming from...

I will keep an eye out for this also Brenda, some of our smaller communities do publish arrest in there newspapers so it wouldn't be to hard to find just doing a search of "those" publications.

Reply by BrendaTx on 12/4/11 12:09pm
Msg #405726

Thanks, James. Or, just send me their names...

and I'll spend my time doing it and not yours...I just want to see what the booking looks like on a notary who failed to give an oath or used invalid ID.

Reply by C. Rivera Chicago Notary Services on 12/5/11 3:56pm
Msg #405821

I support you Brenda! Let us know what you find! n/m

Reply by Buddy Young on 12/3/11 9:22pm
Msg #405706

I did a refi a while back and when I talked to the wife she said her husband was in law inforcement. Later in the conversation, while we were waiting for him to get home, she said he worked for the district atorney.
I didn't ask any further questions, so I don't know exactly what he did for the DA

Reply by Notarysigner on 12/4/11 12:22am
Msg #405714

I started to post about this yesterday also and I agree with everyone else. If there was a "notary police" here in the Bay Area, they themselves should be arrested FOR NOT doing their job!

Reply by 101livescan on 12/4/11 10:42am
Msg #405720

In almost 43 years of being a California notary Public, I've never met the Notary Police...Where the heck are they hiding out.

Now, on many loans I'm the closing notary for on behalf of title/escrow nationally, the lenders are making PTF condition, a copy of my commission, bond and E&O...it is becoming very ordinary and common practice. By the time the processor, underwriter and FRAUDGUARD are completed PTF the loan, everything and ID has been scrubbed squeeky clean. Borrowers are telling me banks want to know what the $2000 deposit was for they made just days before docs are drawn. When the borrower transfers money from asset account to checking to close the escrow (cash to close), the banks are making inquiries, what happened to that money and how are you going to fund this loan. Honestly, it's like the keystone cops.

Point is, we need more notary police? Maybe this is intended for straight notary work, but my own experience is that since there was so much unharnessed fraud, the lenders have gone hard over the other pendulum swing to overcorrect in attempts to prevent ID fraud, money laundering, terrorists activities, etc.

So where are the notary police and what do they look like???

Reply by BrendaTx on 12/4/11 12:17pm
Msg #405728

Exactly!

*So where are the notary police and what do they look like???*

Yep. And, why are they telling good notaries that they are out there arresting notaries for taking "invalid" ID, etc.?

How do they KNOW this unless something criminal takes place? I am guessing that this is more about busting notaries who are participating knowingly in mortgage fraud....and that this information is coming from a person who hasn't done any of what he is talking about.

Just doesn't meet the smell test.

=========

20 years ago...didn't the banks do more of this???

"Borrowers are telling me banks want to know what the $2000 deposit was for they made just days before docs are drawn. When the borrower transfers money from asset account to checking to close the escrow (cash to close), the banks are making inquiries, what happened to that money and how are you going to fund this loan."

By the time I closed on my first home I felt like they had crawled into every crevice of my life.

Reply by 101livescan on 12/4/11 12:31pm
Msg #405730

Re: Exactly!

I liken the entire process of applying for a RE loan, providing financial and employment information, over and over again, to an autopsy, taking out organ by organ, laying them out on a cold silver tray, turning them over while prodding and poking, then reinserting into the body cavity and resewing the long incision. Some procedures are completely unnecessary and some produced no loan approval due to the lenders' matrix of requirements, so all this for nothing. Doesn't matter if you're borrowing $25,000, $250,000 or $2.5 million. Still the same drill.

All on the heals of the fraud this industry perpetuated themselves and who have caused millions of dollars in financial losses, homes, family life, blighting of entire communities, and many many destroyed human lives, collectively. It is horrific and it is not over!

Reply by BrendaTx on 12/4/11 12:53pm
Msg #405732

"Margin Call" the movie...

I just watched this last night.

http://margincallmovie.com/

Great cast...if I was not interested in the mortgage business, I doubt that I would have watched it past the first 20 minutes...but, it made a lot of sense to me.

Reply by Shoshana/AZ on 12/4/11 1:07pm
Msg #405734

Very Scary Movie

It made me mad. Of course they got away with it in "real life" as well as in "reel life". They had no scruples. This was almost as bad as Madoff's Ponzi scheme.

Reply by BrendaTx on 12/4/11 2:56pm
Msg #405741

It made me pretty mad, too. It was like, "How could

they have done that??" But, they did. Then, I guess they paid off all the traders for sending the toxic crap to the next guy and bad behavior was handsomely rewarded.

Reply by GOLDGIRL/CA on 12/4/11 1:20pm
Msg #405736

Thanks alot, Cheryl!

Now, when a borrower starts whining to me about how the lender left no stone unturned before approving their loan, I'll be thinking of his liver or imagining his intestines laid out on the table or wondering how his gall bladder survived the "autopsy."

I'll probably start giggling in order to get my mind off the gruesome images you have now implanted in my brain - stuck like peanut butter.

In the future stick to those other, wonderful descriptions of yours: sipping pinot amid the warm breezes flowing off the avacado orchard with a glowing ocean sunset ending the day. Stuff like that.

Reply by 101livescan on 12/4/11 2:18pm
Msg #405740

Re: Thanks alot, Cheryl!

very simply, I'd rather have a root canal than apply for a refinance/purchase loan these days. I'd love a vacation too. Can't wait for warmer weather, already! Frost warning here after those horrible winds that wreaked so much havoc all over the nation!