Posted by snoopdogMs on 2/21/11 9:13am
Msg #373517

1003 application

I had a closing with some explicit instructions for certain documents, one of them being the 1003. It read......Please be sure that the borrower and co-borrower do not sign if they are not on the note. Fearing that I am having a senior moment here, it is possible to have a borrower and co-borrower that are not on the note? I have yet to close nearly 3000 loans that when there is both a borrower and co-borrower, they are both responsible and both sign the note. I think that what they really meant to say was in reference to a non-borrowing spouse. This particular closing was a purchase, with a non-borrowing spouse.

Reply by snoopdogMs on 2/21/11 9:18am
Msg #373518

question should read "is it possible, not it is possible" n/m

Reply by Bob_Chicago on 2/21/11 9:41am
Msg #373520

Fearing that I am having a senior moment here,

Hey, what's wrong about senior moments. Means you've been around long enough to have one.
As to your question, sounds like it was a generic "borrower /co-borrower." Masny loan dox have the word "borrower" on signature lines even if they are a non borowing sp;use or other party with an interest in the property , but not to be personally obligated on the loan.
If a party to the transaction is not on the note, then they are not on the 1003.
Normally only check credit on those who are on the hook for the loan.

Reply by upnorth/AK on 2/21/11 10:17am
Msg #373523

Except for USAA loans

The USAA loans require that even nonborrowing spouses not only sign the 1003 but they have a separate one from the borrower. It has been questioned several times by the borrower but USAA just tells them that is their policy.

Reply by Susan Fischer on 2/21/11 10:33pm
Msg #373619

Then I would never qualify for a USAA loan - I'll be dipped

if I would sign a federal form, under oath, that said I was applying for a loan, let alone in joint credit, if I weren't.

The 1003 is an Application for Credit. What I have never understood is a demand a non-borrower sign such an application under oath.

jmho

Reply by ReneeK_MI on 2/22/11 5:39am
Msg #373627

? never saw an oath on a 1003

Just a statement "this is true and correct". Maybe there's another version I've just never seen (or bothered to read)?

Reply by Susan Fischer on 2/22/11 2:14pm
Msg #373701

"I/We fully understand that it is a Federal crime punishable

by fine or imprisonment, or both, to knowingly make any false statements concerning any of the above facts as applicable under the provisions of Title 18, United States Code, Section 1001, et seq."

Bottom of the last (p 5/5) page.

Reply by ReneeK_MI on 2/22/11 5:37am
Msg #373626

permitted in community property states

This is made clear in the top paragraph on page 1 of the 1003, there's a check-box relative to this.

Reply by Victoria_NJ on 2/22/11 8:28pm
Msg #373742

the operative word is borrower

Borrower is the person(s) signing the Note, which is the financial guarentee, vs Mortgage which is the recordable doc that address legal interests (maritial, additional names on title, etc. into the property)

(a) Non-Borrowing Spouse or Civil Union Partner perfecting mortgage and title for marital/CU interest in property; Does not sign 1003;

(b) Guarentor on loan, signing mortgage only; Does not sign 1003;

(c) Additional names on title,(related or non-related persons, etc.) but is not a borrower signing the Note; Does not Sign 1003

Reply by ReneeK_MI on 2/23/11 4:47am
Msg #373774

Details from the 1003 re: community property =)

At the very top, it says:

"This application is designed to be completed by the applicant(s) with the Lender’s assistance. Applicants should complete this form as "Borrower" or "Co-Borrower," as applicable. Co-Borrower information must also be provided (and the appropriate box checked) when [ ] the income or assets of a person other than the Borrower (including the Borrower’s spouse) will be used as a basis for loan qualification or [ ] the income or assets of the Borrower’s spouse or other person who has community property rights pursuant to state law will not be used as a basis for loan qualification, but his or her liabilities must be considered because the spouse or other person has community property rights pursuant to applicable law and Borrower resides in a community property state, the security property is located in a community property state, or the Borrower is relying on other property located in a community property state as a basis for repayment of the loan. "

not need to include information on that person's liabilities if he or she is not an applicant."

The mortgage will also refer to those non-borrowers who are required to acknowledge the mortgage as "borrowers", and they sign at the line titled "Borrower", but they are appropriately described w/in the language of the document. In these instances, just being swept into the "Borrower" label doesn't make you a borrower.

Bottom line - if you don't sign the Note, you're not obligated as a borrower.

Since I'm not in a Community Property state, this is all outside my scope - I also found it unusual (non-borrower having their own 1003), but was prompted by curiousity to investigate. All the 1003's I've had signed, I never recalled these little details being right there, up front - since they never applied to me, and I've never encountered it myself.