Posted by CopperheadVA on 2/24/11 1:34pm
Msg #374033

Attn: Virginia Notaries RE: notarization via web cam

Email from the NNA:

With votes last week, both the House of Delegates and the Senate have passed HB2318 — the bill that will allow electronic notarizations to be performed with video-conferencing technology as an acceptable form of “personal appearance” before the Notary. In spite of the loud call by Notaries throughout the Commonwealth — a majority of both House Delegates and State Senators have allowed this dangerous legislation to move to the Governor’s desk for his signature — and thereby setting up the final step to enact the bill as law.

Although the bill’s video-conference provisions will not become effective until July 2012, contacting Governor McDonnell is our last opportunity to defeat this legislation’s attempts to weaken your ability to properly screen a signer for identify, volition and willingness. We urge that you contact the Governor to express your strong concerns regarding this legislation — and urge him veto the bill.

Thanks to the collective voice of Notaries over the past several weeks, legislators have been forced to listen and combat reality checks in the process of advancing this legislation. Your voice now can carry even greater weight as your Governor, singlehandedly, can weaken or protect the Office of the Notary Public in the Commonwealth of Virginia with the stroke of a pen. Please call and/or write to him today and urge him to VETO HB 2318.

Thank you for allowing The National Notary Association to support your role as a protector of the public trust.

Regards,

Michael Robinson
Director of External Communications


There was a link in the email to the Governor McDonnell's contact page:
http://www.governor.virginia.gov/Contact.cfm

Reply by Cheryl Meril on 2/24/11 1:38pm
Msg #374035

Wow, this is unbelievable. This opens the door to all kinds of potential fraud, what about thumb prints for deeds? Do they give it electronically on the other end?

Reply by CopperheadVA on 2/24/11 1:43pm
Msg #374039

Thumbprints are not required for notarizations in VA.

Reply by Sandra Clark on 2/24/11 2:35pm
Msg #374047

I have just sent a message to our Gov asking for his veto. I hope others both in VA and nationwide will do the same. It to only a matter of minutes to fill out the form and type in our message. Please join with us to try & stop this from being signed into law..............thanks

Reply by JanetK_CA on 2/24/11 2:45pm
Msg #374050

My 2 cents to the VA Gov, for what it's worth

Gotta give credit where credit is due, so kudos to the NNA for trying to fight this. This is one area where I support their efforts.

I've finally weighed in on this issue and here's my message, FWIW:

"As a long-time notary public, I respectfully request that you veto HB2318 about electronic notarizations, allowing the use of a webcam for the universal requirement for "personal appearance". I believe that would be a recipe for disaster that would make the act of notarization all but meaningless in your state - and others, should this idea spread. There is no reliable substitute for being physically present in order to determine a person's willingness to sign a document. Just a couple of examples: I've seen family members try to coerce a parent to sign a Power of Attorney against their will. It would be very easy for that to be done off camera. Also, I've been presented with fake IDs a number of times. I don't believe I'd have been able to detect the fakes without physically touching and seeing them up close. Allowing this change sets a dangerous precedent, in my opinion, and significantly reduces the ability of a notarization to help fight fraud, at a time when it is rampant. If the reason for having a signature notarized on a document is valid to begin with, the process should be handled in a way that maintains its integrity. This bill would eliminate what every knowledgeable notary public knows to be a critical component of every notarization."


I don't know if our collective notes will make a difference, but it's certainly worth a try. (Feel free to plagiarize any part of this. BTW, it would be a good idea to include the bill number in the field where it asks the subject.)

Reply by LKT/CA on 2/24/11 6:01pm
Msg #374086

I gave my 2 cents in an email to the VA governor and included the link from the CA SOS that outlaws webcam notarizations. Hope it helps.

Reply by James Dawson on 2/24/11 6:20pm
Msg #374090

Why do you have to fill out 50 million bit's of personal info just to tell him Don't do it! Whew!

Reply by MW/VA on 2/24/11 7:05pm
Msg #374097

I had sent an email to the Gov. several weeks ago, asking

that he veto this. From what's been discussed earlier on this forum, it appears that someone in VA owns a business that will benefit from it. Good luck to the state to try to police this, because we all know it will open doors wide-open to fraud. A reminder again, the e-notarization is a separate entity from our commissed notary criteria.

Reply by JanetK_CA on 2/24/11 7:56pm
Msg #374107

Re: I had sent an email to the Gov. several weeks ago, asking

"the e-notarization is a separate entity from our commissed notary criteria."

I guess I'm not clear on how this would supposedly work in practice. Would the end product of an "e-notarization" be considered equivalent to a notarization done on paper (or electronically) by a fully commissioned NP? Would the general public seeking a notarization be able to choose between a "regular" notary or an "e-notarization" person?

[I didn't read all the articles and links on this subject, so please forgive me if this was already explained previously - which it sounds like it has. Or a message # would be great, too. Thanks!]

It also appears that someone supposedly based out of Newport Beach, CA might benefit from it... With his model, the location would become irrelevant.

Reply by Marian_in_CA on 2/24/11 8:13pm
Msg #374108

Re: I had sent an email to the Gov. several weeks ago, asking

E-notarization is simply the use of electronic seal on an electronic document, just a a rubber stamp on paper. I use this right now in an attorney's office where they try to be as paperless as possible. I've been told I'm the only notary in my area that has an electronic seal, and that's why they call me. When they need something notarized, they make an appointment. The signer is there with ID, as usual... the difference is that the signature is captured electronically on the document using an input pad like those on credit card machines, and I secure it with my own signature and seal. I have special software that helps me do this... software that most notaries probably wouldn't dream of needing.

My journal is still paper-based, though. Signers sign and print just a usual. There are electronic journals out there, but I don't think they're practical for mobile notaries because it involves more equipment.

Reply by JanetK_CA on 2/24/11 9:21pm
Msg #374115

Re: I had sent an email to the Gov. several weeks ago, asking

Got that. But this is the part I was questioning:

"A reminder again, the e-notarization is a separate entity from our commissed notary criteria."

It's the "separate entity" part that I'm wondering about specifically. Seems like this implies that - at least under this proposed Virginia law - that the individuals who conduct these online "notarizations" via webcam would exist under some other authority or be commissioned differently. I figure I must be missing something here...

Reply by CopperheadVA on 2/25/11 6:26am
Msg #374124

Re: I had sent an email to the Gov. several weeks ago, asking

In order to do notarization via web cam, the notary would have to hold a VA electronic notary commission, which is a separate commission from a traditional VA notary commission. Both traditional and electronic notary commissions are governed by the Virginia Secretary of the Commonwealth; commissions are signed by the governor.

Reply by James Dawson on 2/25/11 7:44am
Msg #374130

Re: I had sent an email to the Gov. several weeks ago, asking

thanks for the explanation Copperhead.

Reply by JanetK_CA on 2/25/11 2:10pm
Msg #374193

Re: I had sent an email to the Gov. several weeks ago, asking

Thanks. Any idea what the differences would be other than one person doing the traditional notarization and the other doing an electronic notarization? Maybe it's just a way to increase revenue, 'cause I'm guessing, in practice, that it would mean lots of people applying for both commissions, if allowed.

Reply by MW/VA on 2/25/11 8:25am
Msg #374132

Got this reply today......

Fri, February 25, 2011 8:39:47 AMRe: HB2318 -- E-notarization
From: senate district07 <[e-mail address]>Add to Contacts
To: [e-mail address]


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Dear Ms. Wells:


Thank you for contacting our office regarding Senate Bill 827, which allows, in the case of electronic notarization, a notary to notarize a document when the signer is not in the notary's presence if satisfactory evidence of the identity is established. As a notary myself, I agree entirely with what you said in opposition to the bill and foresee many problems with this practice.


However, unfortunately the bill did pass, with House amendments that struck the provision stating the act shall not become effective unless reenacted by the 2012 session of the General Assembly, to language stating that "the provisions of this act relating to the use of video and audio conference technology shall become effective July 1, 2012."


Let me also mention that becoming an "electronic notary" is strictly voluntary (with an additional fee, I believe), and we as notaries can choose to remain "paper notaries,'' who notarize documents with signers present with appropriate identification.


Again, thank you for your interest in this bill. I had hoped it would be defeated, but will choose to remain a "regular" Notary Public.


Kindest regards,


Debra Scott, L.A.

Reply by James Dawson on 2/25/11 8:58am
Msg #374135

Re: Got this reply today......

So it will become legal in VA 2012, until then still illegal right?

Are they doing that in Va now?

How will we be able to tell the difference between a WebCam Notarization from a "in the presence" Notarization if a Document (such as a subordination agreement for example) is used in a State where it isn't legal? BTW I don't expect anyone to know that answer at this time, just a thought.

Reply by Linda_H/FL on 2/25/11 9:02am
Msg #374136

If the webcam notarization took place in a state

where that type of notarization is legal, then it should be accepted by all states as mandated by Federal Statute -

In VA the bill is on the governor's desk - if he doesn't veto or send it back for amendment it will become law and will go into effect July, 2012.

Reply by James Dawson on 2/25/11 9:04am
Msg #374137

Re: If the webcam notarization took place in a state

Sounds like the next move is to find out from our S O S about this.

Reply by MikeC/NY on 2/26/11 4:44pm
Msg #374373

Re: If the webcam notarization took place in a state

"where that type of notarization is legal, then it should be accepted by all states as mandated by Federal Statute"

Linda, there is no such statute - there is only the "Full Faith and Credit" clause of the Constitution, which has always been assumed to include notarizations, among other things. As far as I know, that assumption has never been challenged in a Federal court, but that doesn't make it law.

Reply by Lee/AR on 2/25/11 9:08am
Msg #374138

Reply from VA (+ e-mail addy to add your voice)

" Thank you for contacting the Office of Governor Bob McDonnell. The Governor is in receipt of your letter regarding HB 2318, and he appreciates you taking the time to share your ideas and concerns with him. He has asked me to respond on his behalf.

Once a bill reaches the Governor's desk for his review, Governor McDonnell may exercise the following powers granted to him by Article V, Section 6 of the Constitution of Virginia: sign, veto, or offer recommendation for amendment. All bills that the Governor vetoes or offers recommendations for amendment are returned to the General Assembly for review. Alternatively, Governor McDonnell may decline to act on a bill, which will allow the bill to become law without his signature.

Again, thank you for your letter. The Governor appreciates your input and will take it into consideration during this process. I hope that you will continue to provide Governor McDonnell with the benefit of your views on matters affecting the Commonwealth. Please do not hesitate to contact this office in the future.

Sincerely,
Kathy Terry
Director of Community Relations
Office of Governor Robert F. McDonnell "


Please do not reply to this e-mail address. Replies sent to this e-mail address will NOT be read. To send a reply, please use the contact form on the Governor's website, located at http://www.governor.virginia.gov/TheAdministration/contactGovernor.cfm.

Reply by Linda_H/FL on 2/25/11 9:10am
Msg #374139

That's the exact same response I received. n/m

Reply by Lee/AR on 2/25/11 9:54am
Msg #374145

Yeah, canned. Like the one MW/VA received better. n/m

Reply by CopperheadVA on 2/25/11 10:03am
Msg #374147

Same response here from Governor's Office n/m

Reply by Sandra Clark on 2/25/11 11:48am
Msg #374159

Re: Same response here from Governor's Office

Same here..........