Posted by Les_CO on 2/2/11 11:27am
Msg #371014

Lower fees/an analogy

An analogy that may help explain some of our problems when it comes to lower fees offered today.
I’ve been in this business a long time.
I have both a UPS account and a FedEx account.
Because of my low volume I really have no idea about the ‘volume discounts’ that the large Title Companies get except that they pay substantially less that I do. (Perhaps $6 for what costs me $25)
I use FedEx more than UPS.
I like FedEx more than UPS
I find the people at my local FedEx office ‘store’ friendly helpful, competent, and understanding. Actually my now local UPS store is pretty good too, but I’ve been in ones that were rude, unhelpful, stupid, and could care less.
The delivery people/drivers of both could not be better.
I have had problems with UPS on an ongoing, and weekly basis for years (not on my account, but for packages I ship on behalf of others)
I have never had a problem with FedEx.
I think this to be true throughout our industry.
Then WHY to these Title Companies suffer with shipping problems EVERY DAY, using UPS, rather that FedEx?
Remember the HUD!!…and the “Courier Fees?” Their customer (The Borrower/ Buyer) PAYS the fees!!
Because UPS is a little bit less expensive…and they the TCs, keep the difference from what they charge the borrower and what they actually pay, and it adds up.
If they will suffer all this inconvenience, on a daily basis for a few cents, think about what they will be willing to do for an extra $25 to $50!
I personally think that keeping the difference from what the borrower is charged for shipping or Notary/Remote Closing fees to be a violation of HUD. But TC’s are doing this every day, and getting away with it.
The low-ballers are coming!
JMO

Reply by BrendaTx on 2/2/11 11:37am
Msg #371017

*and they the TCs, keep the difference*

Are they still allowed to do things like that? I know that once upon a time HUDs were padded like a feather pillow but didn't realize they could still get by with it.

I would guess courier fees of a major title company are contracted for with overnight package shipping with FedEx for $10 or less. Just a guess based on what our rate is here.

Reply by James Dawson on 2/2/11 11:47am
Msg #371019

I actually work for a TC That states the fee that will be charged in a disclosure to the borrower and they still pay the notary less then what they are telling the borrower what it will cost them! Go figure..

Reply by Les_CO on 2/2/11 1:15pm
Msg #371024

Because we're down to pennies. In CA an escrow State it should be a bit different. The TC could/should (as per the law imo) charge the borrower the exact courier fees (or notary fees) attributable to the actual closing, and not ‘estimate’. In most cases they attribute $50-$75 courier fees to the particular closing, and if for some reason it costs more they ‘eat it’ and less they keep the difference. They ‘estimate high. JMO

Reply by Pam/NM on 2/2/11 4:15pm
Msg #371079

Is it possible that the courier fees aren't limited to having docs shipped back post signing? I know that several borrowers have told me they rec'd disclosure pkgs via FedEx and UPS lately. And on occasion, more often now than before, I've been sent out for a single doc signing that required another courier fee for them. No doubt they are still padded, but we may not see the whole picture

Reply by CopperheadVA on 2/2/11 4:19pm
Msg #371080

They also have to ship the DOT/Mortgage to the abstractor for recording. Additionally, they ship the executed lender docs back to the lender.

Reply by Les_CO on 2/2/11 4:35pm
Msg #371092

Yes the Title Companies ‘courier’ many documents, not just to us, or back to themselves but to (typically) the new lender, the old lender (payoff) the county (recording) and sometimes to the broker…. My example was an ANALOGY…an EXAMPLE! …I was not trying to be PRECISE….I was trying to infer things that I believe to be similar in that that they do not always reflect the EXACT fees charged.
Sorry you missed the point.

Reply by Moneyman/TX on 2/2/11 6:32pm
Msg #371164

Some of those docs are sent by the lender. But you may be correct that they have other "shipping" needs. To be sure, the borrowers are paying for all of it.

Reply by Marian_in_CA on 2/2/11 1:47pm
Msg #371031

Well, I know for a fact that a certain company only pays $4.75 for NextDay Air shipments via FedEx, and this company usually prefers that I ship UPS. I know this because the FedEx lady accidentally ran a receipt with the price on it, and I was shocked it was that low. She confirmed it and said they ship a lot so they have a much reduced cost.

If they're only paying $4.75 for FedEx, and they prefer UPS... UPS must give them a really amazing price.

Reply by Moneyman/TX on 2/2/11 2:28pm
Msg #371051

They do the same with credit reports charges (TC and/or Lender charging this one?) I know that when I was a LO the charge to the company to pull the credit report (all 3) was $2.50. One company I worked for only charged this amount. Another charged $45+. I've seen as high as $70 for credit reports on a few loans within the last few months.

If they don't get in one way, they will find another IMO.

Reply by cayenne1227 on 2/2/11 10:47pm
Msg #371249

well how about this....on hud I have seen a settlement fee and on top of that a notary fee, is that customary? I have only seen that a few times, they are making so much money it makes me sick...why is ss not listed on hud? what is the big "secret"?

Reply by Cari on 2/3/11 12:00am
Msg #371279

I agree with you Les. It is IMPO, that the TCs are STILL totally take advantage of the BO. So much so that some very reputable TCs, charge an extra $400 for notary closing costs when really, they only pay us what, about $125-$175 out of that fee...? Its a ripoff for us NSAs as well!

To make matters worse, some of those BO actually think we get paid that much, and dare we discuss OUR fees with them....oh no taboo...(psst..if they ask I tell 'em the truth)

And you're right Les, they shouldn't be paying more for shipping since it should come out of those inflated notary fees they're illegally alledging on the HUD1...