Posted by JAM/CA on 2/1/11 8:29pm
Msg #370956

Visit from the U.S. Dept. of Justice today

Do keep copious records. Today I had a visit from the DOJ (Drug Enforcement Admin., Senior Financial Investigator) and Department of the Treasury, Special Agent.

First I received a phone call regarding a notarization I did back in November 2007. The notarizations were for an individual purchasing a vehicle off of E-Bay. Seller was a dealer in Sarasota, FL. The DOJ asked for an appointment today and if I remembered anything about the signing.

Upon arrival they showed me their I.D.'s and a copy of one of the notarizations I did for this individual. Someone had added to the certificate, a line that said, Notary Witness and someone had signed this. Anyone ever heard of a "Notary Witness"? This was obviously fraudulent. Everything else was in order on the certificate. There was never a witness there and there was no need for a witness.

The gentlemen that came were shocked by the information I had on this signing from 2007 and that I remembered clearly the city and location. They then pulled out two 8 1/2 x 11 pages with five photo's of men on each page numbered and asked me to pick the person whose signature I notarized back then. I went right to the individual first time. They feel I will be a good witness and may be calling on me again shortly. They did not reveal any information regarding what type of crime had been perpetrated.

I personally had done my job correctly, plus had a thumbprint of the individual I notarized the signature for. The point of this post is, to let Notaries Public know, to be diligent about their record keeping. The information you record in your journals or notes can jog your memory in the future if necessary. We are the first line of defense against fraud. We can help law enforcement catch criminals. We are important!

The DOJ gentleman also told me, he is involved in mortgage fraud cases also.

Just keep in mind, you may be called on in the future.

Reply by rolomia on 2/1/11 10:13pm
Msg #370959

...further illustrating the need for Secretaries of State to require Notaries Public to keep a journal, preferably with fingerprints. Though only currently optional in most states, changing the law to require such record-keeping will help to prevent/reduce fraud both now and later.

Reply by LauriecPA on 2/1/11 10:29pm
Msg #370961

I wish our state required, or even allowed us to fingerprint for our journals. When I've been called in for these fraud claims, I think how much easier it would be if I just had a thumb print instead of a signature. It would clear things up so much faster, and I wouldn't have to get questioned for hours on end.

I call Harrisburg and suggest it, but the answer I get is always "We don't do that here."

(But, we SHOULD!)

Reply by rolomia on 2/1/11 11:04pm
Msg #370962

A thumbprint/fingerprint shouldn't be used instead of a signature, but rather as an addition to it.

Reply by GOLDGIRL/CA on 2/2/11 12:39am
Msg #370964

Good for you, JAM/CA. You're way ahead of me. First of all I wouldn't have had a t-print for this guy because he wasn't signing a deed or POA (not that we were required to t-print POAs in 2007; that came later). Second of all, I wouldn't have been able to recognize a person I signed yesterday, let alone more than 3 years ago. But at least I would have all the stuff recorded in my journal! Also, the "notary witness" thing is pretty bogus - an slightly scary.

Reply by janCA on 2/2/11 8:44am
Msg #370981

Although not required, I always get a thumbprint on a general notarization. No one has ever been averse to it. Also, in my opinion, although a signature is required, I believe a thumbprint is gold, especially for these investigations.

Reply by Yoli/CA on 2/2/11 10:36am
Msg #370998

Like Jan, I always get thumbprint for any notarization. No one's ever questioned it or tried refusing.

IMPHO: If you are who your ID says you are, then there shouldn't be a problem in giving your thumbprint.

Reply by James Dawson on 2/2/11 10:42am
Msg #370999

agree fully.....besides, I'm too old to remember all those faces....

Reply by A S Johnson on 2/2/11 10:55am
Msg #371003

I agree with getting e thumb print.
After the Texas Attorney General advise Notaries we could NOT keep the Driver's Linence number or expirtion date, I stater to get the thumb print. Now the same Attorney General has advised that Notaries can NOT do that.

Reply by SheilaSJCA on 2/2/11 2:02pm
Msg #371039

I tell the signer(s) the thumbrpint is optional, except for those people with documents requiring it- (Deeds, POA's) and that is further proof of who they are and proof of when they appeared before me. Most every one will do the thumbprint, only a few have declined...