Posted by Richard Campbell on 3/19/11 7:20pm
Msg #376726

Sign on the X does not pay

I have been waiting 4 months calling weekly (the accounting person is only there on Wed.) When you call they ship you to a voice mail and no one returns your call. They still call wanting me to take signings from them.(Fat Chance!) Does anyone have sugestions???

Reply by JulieD/KS on 3/19/11 7:25pm
Msg #376727

I've been a signing agent since 2003 and SOX has been known all that time as a non-paying company. I've never once accepted a job from them or their sister company Signatures Plus. Read reviews and don't be blinded by dollar signs. Turn away any company with less than stellar peer reviews. You'll be glad you did.

Reply by Linda_H/FL on 3/19/11 7:27pm
Msg #376728

I don't know how long you've been doing this, Richard

but you need to research the companies you accept assignments from. SOX has been doing this to notaries for, what...6-8 years now? This is not new...and in an effort to be as polite as possible, if you don't check out the companies and watch who you work for you're going straight to the poor house.

I'd suggest small claims court - not that THAT'S gonna make a difference - you'll get a judgment and have to take a number and stand in line to collect it behind all the other notaries before you who've been stiffed by SOX.

I, honestly, can't believe SOX is still in business....

Reply by DD/OR on 3/19/11 8:12pm
Msg #376730

Why don't you go to Signing Central and check out a company before you work for them? You and notaries like you are keeping these crooks in business. That's why they don't go out of business, because they find notaries like you to work for free. Meanwhile they laugh all the way to the bank.

Just out of curiosity, I called several deadbeat company's and asked if they are busy. They said 'yes'. One 1-star deadbeat company said he has been doing about 300 closings a month. So, that tells me that even though this board is helpful, I'm not sure if we are putting many deadbeats out of business.

Reply by JanetK_CA on 3/19/11 9:04pm
Msg #376732

Doesn't surprise me. They can underbid all their competitors all day long if their business plan is to collect fees for work someone else does and then not pay them.

The title companies that hire them either put on blinders and pretend they don't know or they don't pay any attention and really don't know or they're complicit. (Maybe they even get a kickback, for all I know... to be clear, I'm not accusing anyone and have no knowledge about any of this going on. Just speculating.)

Reply by Moneyman/TX on 3/19/11 10:10pm
Msg #376739

"to be clear, I'm not accusing anyone..." maybe we can...

Janet, there may be one way to help negate any of these TC claims such as not knowing the payment history of these companies that are well known to the NSA community to be companies that do not pay NSAs after they have preformed the work requested.

If ALL these notaries that have been stiffed would 1) call the hiring TC and complain about it and 2) follow up that phone call with an email re-stating the information and include the contact name and information of the person they spoke with on the phone call. ** Of course, copious notes would need to be taken and kept by these notaries (including but not limited to the exact date, time of call, length of call, name of contact person, phone number called, details of discussion, etc) ** and 3) follow up the call and email with a letter (same information contained in the email) sent certified mail return receipt to show proof of delivery. (again, keeping this information is also key)

Then after they have completed at least those things post the information on NotRot and as many other sites as possible - who they contacted with details of the exact date and time, etc. and what actions they took (certified letter) and any responses from the TC.

Once the information is made public and there is proof that these companies are continuing to knowingly, and intentionally, hire these deadbeats, it seems to me that at that point that information could be very helpful to help prove in court that these TC are complicit; at least from that point forward.

Disclaimer: I am not an attorney and this should not be considered legal advice, etc, etc, etc

Reply by JanetK_CA on 3/20/11 12:24am
Msg #376757

You may be on to something... They need to be stopped! n/m

Reply by James Dawson on 3/20/11 1:43am
Msg #376759

Re: "to be clear, I'm not accusing anyone..." maybe we can...

I would also find out (google) the CEO, CFO of the TC and send copies of your demand letter to SOX. They probably won't get/read them but their assistant will, it will have a trickle down affect. This will work, trust me. They will fire the SS, just as "you know who"!

Reply by HisHughness on 3/19/11 8:31pm
Msg #376731

This just in

The sun rose in the east this morning.

Somewhere, an Irishman was just sobering up.

More than one ex-wife complained that her husband never understood her.

Dogs chased cats. Cats chased mice. Mice chased b!tchy ex-wives.

Goldman Sachs executives were meeting on the latest way to screw the public.

Every Texan over 10 years old was bragging to someone.

The moon revolved around The Earth. The Earth revolved around the sun. The sun revolved around the center of the Milky Way Galaxy.

SOX stiffed a notary.

The highly offended notary complained on Notary Rotary.

Reply by JAM/CA on 3/19/11 9:04pm
Msg #376733

HisHughness, you are pricelss n/m

Reply by JAM/CA on 3/19/11 9:06pm
Msg #376734

* priceless n/m

Reply by DD/OR on 3/19/11 9:06pm
Msg #376735

That's funny! LOL n/m

Reply by Virginia/PA on 3/19/11 9:52pm
Msg #376737

What else is new n/m

Reply by Susan Fischer on 3/19/11 10:38pm
Msg #376745

As The Notary Stamps - tune in tomorrow for another

exciting episode.

[cue: organ music]

Will SOCKS pay?

Which Ex Mrs Hughness will finally get her revenge...

Which Irishman?

And now a word from our Sponsor...Buy Notary Stuff Here.

[end organ flourish]

Reply by MikeC/NY on 3/19/11 9:57pm
Msg #376738

You can get paid if you are persistant

It is extremely difficult to get money from SOX, but not impossible - and I know this from personal experience, because when I was starting out I made the mistake of accepting work from them. It took a while, but with a little perseverance I finally got paid what I was owed.

Buried deep in their website is this page:

http://www.signonthexinc.com/notary/agreement.php

Pay careful attention to paragraphs 3 and 4, because they WILL ignore you otherwise. You may already be beyond their 90-day limit, but there are other things you can try; send me a PM if you want more info.

These guys are the worst of the worst, and the only way they remain in business is by tracking down new meat - notaries who have never heard of them before. Anyone who has been doing this for any length of time already knows about them, but if you're just starting out you're a perfect target.

It's unfortunate that many of the responses you've received so far are making it seem like it's YOUR fault for not knowing about this; I guess these people were somehow blessed with perfect knowledge when they started out and never ever made a mistake...

Reply by desktopfull on 3/19/11 10:32pm
Msg #376743

Mike SOX hasn't been paying their notaries for over 10 years

if a notary is smart enough to join NotRot then they should have checked signing central or at the very least checked for messages concerning SOX or any signing company that they have never done business with. It's the same with those complaining about NREIS, widely known that they don't pay timely and yet notaries keep taking closings from them thinking that won't happen to me and then complain when it does.

Reply by MikeC/NY on 3/20/11 12:07am
Msg #376754

Re: Mike SOX hasn't been paying their notaries for over 10 years

"if a notary is smart enough to join NotRot then they should have checked signing central "

You're assuming they would do that BEFORE accepting those first assignments. I think in many cases it's the other way around - they find NotRot after they've already been working in the profession for a short time, and now have some questions.

Unless I'm missing something, no one gets handed a referral to NotRot when they get their commission; they generally stumble over it at some point. And then they come here, ask a question, and get pilloried for not knowing something they had no reason to know...

It doesn't make sense to me to berate someone for making a mistake they didn't know they were making - better to tell them "yeah, you screwed up and here's why," and then help them try to fix it if they can. If they make the same mistake again, that's on them and they would deserve whatever bricks are thrown at them. First time out of the gate, however, I think they deserve some slack.

Reply by Lee/AR on 3/19/11 10:45pm
Msg #376746

Yep. You can get paid if you are persistant

Mike really is right. And so is everyone else. SOX will pay only if you are very persistent-- immediately, continuously, keeping records of who said what, when and pull out all stops on who you contact about it. A funny thing I noticed in reading SOX online contract: You must only use their invoice form and only fax to a specific number--within 90 days. Funny...there is no link to their invoice form nor is the specific fax number given.

Reply by Virginia/PA on 3/20/11 12:22am
Msg #376755

Re: Yep. You can get paid if you are persistant

That's how they screwed me. I had an invoice form in my file which had a pre-printed fax number on it. The fax went through without error, but they said after the fact that I had faxed it to the wrong number and my collection call was outside the 90 day window. They changed their fax number from the one on the invoice I was using. Perhaps they change their fax number every 90 days. Nice work if you can get it.

Reply by Virginia/PA on 3/20/11 12:23am
Msg #376756

P.S.

You can submit an online invoice for them, but even when I did that they still stiffed me. They just don't want to pay. Plain and simple.

Reply by desktopfull on 3/19/11 10:26pm
Msg #376740

Really? n/m

Reply by HisHughness on 3/19/11 11:06pm
Msg #376750

I am often amused by signing agents...

...who blithely trumpet that they have/are/will contact the attorney general of their jurisdiction about criminal action against a non-paying signing agency.

A required element of a crime in <every> jurisdiction in this country is what the law calls "mens rea," or intent: The perpetrator must actually intend to commit the crime charged. That intent can sometimes be implied from the circumstances or from a reckless disregard for the consequences of actions, but the intent is <always> required.

Simply not paying a signing agent is not evidence of intent to commit a crime. The failure to pay can be prosecuted as a civil offense, but the attorney general of no state that I know of will act a bill collector in a civil case.

Having said all that, I think that a solid case could be made that in the case of SOX there is genuine and oft-manifested intent to defraud; in other words, SOX hires signing agents up front with no ultimate intent to pay them. That, in my opinion, is fraud, and is the legitimate province of a state attorney general.

What would be helpful would be for every signing agent stiffed by SOX to post his/her name, email address, the date and time of the closing, and a brief synopsis of the reason given, if any, that SOX did not pay, and the agent's attempts to collect (with dates). Make all the reports uniform in the heading, with something like "SOX complaint." That way they could all be assembled with a simple search, and the scope of the problem could be easily ascertained.

After a while, there should be a sufficient number of such reports to establish for an attorney general or district or county attorney somewhere that SOX is deliberately setting out to defraud signing agents, and we could put an end to this unceasing stream of plaintive cries about nonpayment from SOX.

After which we could focus our efforts on some other deserving signing company.

Reply by Susan Fischer on 3/19/11 11:27pm
Msg #376753

That sounds like The Plan, YourHughness. Build the File.

Finding out the AG, or DA/CA's names/addresses and posting may be useful to begin the process of Documenting the File.

Oooh. And there are so many after SOX...

Reply by Venita Peyton on 3/20/11 8:10am
Msg #376762

Hi Richard. I've never heard of Sign X. I send a contract requiring an electronic signature to companies who call me (and haven't asked for an application, W-9, Proof of Insurance). I also have the client sign, to acknowledge that I performed the work.

Reply by 101livescan on 3/21/11 9:16am
Msg #376831

Richard, I wouldn't spend another nanosecond trying to figure out why they're not paying you or contacting them again for payment. File a Small Claims Action against them, get their attention. Maybe they'll cut you a check before you get to court.

Then, Never, Never, Never take another job with a signing service without checking into Signing Central to determine reputation and track record of these companies.

SOX is the very worst of the worst. Can't tell where you're located, but they are in Orange County. I'd go after them with everything I had if I were in your shoes. GOOD LUCK! Hope you get paid. Otherwise, chalk it up to charity, and believe me they are living high on the hog on your money.

Reply by Eva75Eva on 3/22/11 12:36pm
Msg #377082

You have to keep pestering them to get paid. I finally got payment by February for signings I did for them in November. I've been calling now for three weeks to get paid for invoices due from last December. After December I quit taking calls from them. Here's a tip that may or may not help-apparently their accounting department is only open on Wednesdays. I can only reach them on this day of the week, which is bad because sometimes someone will pick up and other days it just goes to voice mail. Good luck.

Reply by Wais Sarwari on 3/29/11 11:19am
Msg #377779

they called for a closing last week and I told them the only way I could take care of this closing if they pay by pay pal and they of course say NO and I told them that they have take my name off their listing until they can pay by pay pal then they can call me. They are not worth wasting my minute. We all work hard what we do and we deserve to get paid not to chase around these non sense companies.

Reply by JR/Fl on 4/26/11 4:14pm
Msg #381371

Thanx everyone, I just declined a job from SOX after reading horror stories.

I have 1 Speedy invoice left and 1 from Genuine title. I don't need another no pay-slow pay.