Posted by John/CT on 4/24/12 11:24am
Msg #418748

A Moral / Notary Dilemma

The order confirmation gives only the borrower's work number. I call and leave a voice-mail message. Get a return call from borrower's FORMER boss, telling me he no longer works there. Problem: Many packages contain an Occupancy/Financial Status Affidavit ... which in part has the borrower confirm their employment/financial/personal status has not changed since applying for the loan. Borrower signs. My turn to notarize ... knowing full well the signer has lied. I know I'm not the "truth police", and should simply "notarize, not analyze" (as has been said here before) ... but I certainly wouldn't feel good about it.

What do you others think? Thanx

Reply by Yowheelz on 4/24/12 11:50am
Msg #418750

I would have called the SC or Title Co and asked for a valid phone number explaining that the borrower no longer worked at that location. May be a legit mistake but it throws the ball back in their court.

Reply by dutchcloser on 4/24/12 11:53am
Msg #418751

I agree with Yowheelz. Call and ask for another contact number. It may be true that he/she is not working there but he/she may have another job that the mortgage company is already aware about.

Reply by Glenn Strickler on 4/24/12 11:53am
Msg #418752

Could be the BO just got a better job. It happens. I would call the company that hired you and ask for updated contact numbers and give them the reason why. But don't add an opinion or jump to any conclusions. It could be it's already been taken care of and will work out when you get there. When it comes to the Occupancy/Financial Status Affidavit, if there s one, just explain carefully what they are swearing to. I bet it will work out. But the bottom line is that you are administering an oath and notarizing a signature.

Reply by JustANotary on 4/24/12 12:10pm
Msg #418754

I once did a reverse mortgage signing where the son was signing for his elderly parent. There were packing boxes all over the house, and the son told me he was moving his mother out of the area to where it was cheaper to live. I asked if he knew that having her live in the house was a condition of having a reverse mortgage. He said yes, he knew that. I left it at that thinking it was none of my business. On the other hand, if I saw evidence of elder abuse I would consider it my business.

Reply by Barb25 on 4/24/12 12:46pm
Msg #418758

Really??? Not only don't you know the circumstances. They are beyond none of your business. As a notary or any other way.... Reverse the situation and think about it. And I mean all of this with nothing but respect for your good but misplaced intentions.

Reply by CH2inCA on 4/24/12 1:07pm
Msg #418760

Did you sound like a salesperson

I work in an office, answer the phones when the receptionists are away from their desks. Staff members often tell us to say that they no longer work here if it sounds like a salesperson. Usually I just tell them, that the person is not available. When then again, just means they're going to call back again, and again.

It may be that the person IS lying, and your BO Does work there. I don't think you really know for sure.

Reply by jba/fl on 4/24/12 1:36pm
Msg #418762

Another take on this:
This is a refi with the same company and they are using the old 1009....all the old info.

Reply by Ernest__CT on 4/24/12 2:35pm
Msg #418765

Agree with others who say to call it in _when you first learn_ that the borrower's (possibly former) boss says that the borrower not longer works there. Always, always bump it up the food chain! Not your call to quiz the borrower.

Never your decision to notarize / not notarize as long as you don't know _for absolutely certain_ that the signer is not telling the truth. Be sure that the signer knows what is being sworn to, administer the oath, notarize. Period.

Reply by Anita Edwards on 4/24/12 3:06pm
Msg #418773

I had this happen to me not long ago. When we came to that document I very plainly and more so than usual explained the content. I was then told that yes he had indeed lost his job but with his lower interest rate could continue making house payements on his long term unemployment compensastion. The lender may not see things that way but its the other side of the fence. Getting the month off with no house payment will buy some time also to look for a job. It all made sense and sounded way better than going into foreclosure in a couple of months. I notarized because they both proved to me beyond a doubt that they were the people named in the documents and thats what I was there to do. It is not my place to decide what is best for them and thier family nor would the lender understand the situation because there is no empathy in that world at all.

Reply by LKT/CA on 4/24/12 4:37pm
Msg #418790

2nd Employment and Credit Check done

I believe even after docs are signed, a 2nd employment verification and credit check are done before the loan funds and closes. They check to see if borrower bought a new boat, jet skis, or new cars which will push their DTI (debt to income) rations out of range, thus disqualifying them from the loan.

Not sure how it works if refinancing just the rate and term with the same lender.

Reply by MikeC/TX on 4/24/12 5:06pm
Msg #418792

I agree with the others - just call it in and let whoever hired you know that the phone number you were given is no longer valid. The explanation could be as simple as they had an old phone number, but it's up to them to decide where to go with this. Make them aware, and let them make the call on how to move forward. You don't know the facts, so deciding that they're lying on an affidavit is way above your pay grade.

Also, keep in mind that taking a jurat does not mean the statements contained in the document are true - it simply means that you identified the signer, and they took an oath stating that those statements are true. Unless you know beyond any doubt that they're lying (and how often does that happen?), you're doing exactly what you're supposed to be doing.