Posted by HSH/WA on 11/9/12 11:30pm
Msg #442865

You're signing a refi after hours with no RTC, what do you

do? We are strickly the notary, is it our problem if something is missing in the docs?

Reply by PegiT_MN on 11/9/12 11:46pm
Msg #442866

I have never had a lender leave out a RTC.....but I guess there is a first time for everything. Is it their primary residence or is it by chance an investment property or even a second home where no RTC is required? Not sure what you should do.

Reply by GOLDGIRL/CA on 11/9/12 11:48pm
Msg #442867

Could depend on the lender. Sometimes there's no RTC if borrower is refnanciing with same lender, no cash out and some other specs. Also, silly question, but are you sure they were refinancing their prinicpal residence?

Reply by leeinla on 11/10/12 12:42am
Msg #442870

I had the same thing. I believe it was an investment property. I wrote in my journal that there is no RTC in the package.

Reply by JanetK_CA on 11/10/12 1:36am
Msg #442874

If it was an investment property, there is no rescission period, so there shouldn't be any RTC forms in the package. Same thing with a second home, as was stated above.

Reply by Scriba/NM on 11/10/12 12:57am
Msg #442871

Unless you've only been signing loans for a week, you should REVIEW the documents you are sent, as soon as possible. Normally, when you are sent docs, a good signing agent reviews them, either before (intelligent) or after printing better than nothing). If there is no RTC and your REVIEW of the Occupancy Statement shows the borrower is actually residing in the residence being refinanced as his principal abode, then you CALL (or email) the person sending you the docs or someone at the title company to confirm one way or the other.

There is no such thing as "You are strickly the notary"....... if you think that you need to get out of this business and work at Burger King or Domino's. By the way, it's STRICTLY.

A good signing agent REVIEWS his packages, KNOWS what the documents mean, and carries out the signing of loan docs PROFESSIONALLY.

You are not responsible for the content of the packages, however you are responsible for using a modicum of common sense. You don't wait until you get to the borrower's home to discover that "something" is missing. That makes you look like an amateur.

Reply by HisHughness on 11/10/12 7:10am
Msg #442877

***A good signing agent REVIEWS his packages***

A good signing agent will quite frequently be a busy signing agent, which means he must often print and run, thus leaving no time for reviewing documents. In such instances, the good signing agent is quite justified in relying upon the lender and title company document processors to do THEIR jobs, and make sure that the signing packet is complete.

Reply by oldhippie_IL on 11/10/12 7:31am
Msg #442878

I agree with Hugh. It seems like we as notaries are doing additional work for their mistakes, and for less money. EOM, we don't have time to sit and review the package, nor should we. I have been in this business to know what is suppose to be there, but don't always have the time for review, especially when they send last minute. I would like if they followed us around for one month, I do believe they would have more appreciation for us.

Reply by Buddy Young on 11/10/12 9:23pm
Msg #442983

I have the docs signed as they are sent to me. The only think I check for after printing is to make sure my printer printed every thing in english and not Russian, which has happened before more than once.

Reply by jba/fl on 11/10/12 8:15am
Msg #442881

If I can not reach anyone, we proceed as the package dictates. I cannot substitute or add an RTC as that would be UPL; I have to trust the TC & Lender know what they are doing.

Hugh's answer is great.....we have to rely on their experience in putting the package together. Upon returning the package, you can add note to that effect if you wish - or use assume they do know what they are doing. In any case, keep the package so that if you are questioned, you can let them know with confidence it was not in the package.

Paper trails are a good thing.

Reply by 101livescan on 11/10/12 8:17am
Msg #442882

Right on, but that's in a PERFECT WORLD...in all my years of this career, I've run iinto more flawed packages than ever.

Once I attended a signing, four signers, two couples who own a 400 acre equestrian ranch near me. I'm meeting them at a restaurant in town. Only three show up, I inquire about Mrs. X. Everyone turns ashen. Should we tell her? She was killed in a horseriding mishap just six months before. I wanted to be swallowed up in a sink hole. I was devastated at my faux paux.

Last month, I received three packages that were not scanned properly and could not be used at the signing.

WTH...all evening, EOM, no one to talk to. I've had docs where there was no TIL, no RTC, no HUD

Good grief, who's steering the Titanic?

Reply by PegiT_MN on 11/10/12 9:35am
Msg #442899

Standing Ovation For Hugh .......

......I couldn't have said it better myself Hugh. Thank you!

and what is with this go work at Burger King, Dominoes crap every time someone asks a question that the high and mighty think is so beneath them. I am so sick of this crap. The lady asked a very legitimate question and all it needed was an answer, which most of the people on here gave here....thank you. She did not need that go work at Burger King, Dominoes bull crap. And Hugh is right......the lenders and title companies need to do their jobs.

Reply by ReneeK_MI on 11/10/12 11:10am
Msg #442913

On this point, I disagree Hugh

Self-employed does mean we each make our own protocols, for certain. IMO & IME, to print-and-fly is to invite trouble, and trouble often doesn't even need an invitation. It never fails to be a lesson learned again the hard way for me - nothing like showing up 35 miles away with a pkg containing 100 blank pages (did it) or a Note that somehow printed HUGE text and only the top left corner of the intended text (did that, too).

There's another part to this disagreement - IMO, laying 'blame' is the same as the waitress saying "Sorry, you're not my table." It's not about whose fault something is, who dropped the ball or whose next paycheck might be their last - it's about rising to the higher level. You know, the old sage words 'if you're going to do something, do it well'.

With all due respect, I don't think saying "It's not my table" works all that well in ANY service environment, nor do I think it behooves us as a whole.

Reply by HisHughness on 11/10/12 11:20am
Msg #442915

Re: On this point, I disagree Hugh

There is a vast gulf between seeing that a packet is not printed in blank, and reviewing a packet to make sure all the documents are there. I am not going to assume that responsibility UNLESS I am compensated for it -- the same way I expect to be compensated for faxing and scanning, printing revisions, ad infinitum.

It IS part of my responsibility to make sure what I take to the table is in correct format, not cut off, etc. It is NOT part of my responsibility to make sure the attorney's privacy notice is included. That is not only not my table, it's not even my restaurant.

Reply by 101livescan on 11/10/12 8:44am
Msg #442886

I signed a big whig from Adobe Software in town last night who is buying second home here. Of course, there is no RTC on purchase or second home refi.

However, there are conflicting documents in his package. One, there is a second home rider which will record with the DOT. Two, there is an occupancy affidavit that says he lives there as his principal residence and must live in the home for six months at least after the transaction closes.

I tell him, just sign it, it's a one size fits all document, if we don't sign it, WF might kick it out of loan doc review and send it ack out for signature. He's had a couple of ales, I get him to sign it although he's shaking his head.

See, NOT A PERFECT WORLD once again.

Reply by ArtG/KS on 11/10/12 8:50am
Msg #442890

Hugh is right. Its their responsibility to have the package correct before it is sent to us. Unlike congress, they are supposed to read it over first before its passed on to us. As for RTC's, there never is one if its investment or rental property and thereby rising to the level of a commercial transaction.

Reply by Shoshana/AZ on 11/10/12 12:28pm
Msg #442928

I would never ask a signer to sign a doc that does not apply to his situation. Secondly, that's UPL to tell him or talk him into signing especially with alcohol in his system. If that's the occupancy affidavit, then you sign a jurat or an ack (if I remember right) that says you are signing under penalty of perjury. It's not a one size fits all document!

Reply by ReneeK_MI on 11/10/12 10:50am
Msg #442912

Look at the HUD for a clue

Is the disbursement date set in the future to accommodate a rescission period? If it is, and there is no RTC form - it is likely an error (either on title end, or on lender's end).

Is the disbursement date the same as the settlement date? If it is, and there is no RTC form, then title & lender are on the same page (and you're not invited to debate it).

While any lender MAY, at their own discretion, provide a rescission period - it is not REQUIRED by Reg Z (the governing law) if it is a refinance from lender-to-same-lender, AND there is no increase in the amount financed. The new loan amt CAN include closing costs for the refi.

Reply by HSH/WA on 11/10/12 11:18am
Msg #442914

Re: Thanks guys for not sending me to Burger King. n/m