Posted by NVLSlady/VA on 4/4/13 5:38pm
Msg #464468

Check of Certificate Wording

Not for: notaries who have no qualms about non-notarial acts (and have good signing agent coverage)

Caught some "new" wording on the notarial certificate -Affidavit of Survey- the next morning AFTER the signing: "signed and delivered in my presence."

WHAT was signed and delivered? The survey? The document/affidavit itself? Anyway, with "fresh" eyes after I had notarized the night before, I changed the wording in the certificate to jurat wording. How would others handle?

btw, there was a legal doc, Notice to VA loan applicants where I missed little dash lines __ __ __ TOP BODY OF the document for borrowers initials, so I guess reviewing later was a good idea. So funny, we dislike the "readers" who take so much time on the signing; however, now the notary has to Read every line! I don't know how I'm going to grow to the 15 minute close at this rate . . .

Reply by anotaryinva on 4/4/13 6:12pm
Msg #464474

Is there a question here? n/m

Reply by VT_Syrup on 4/4/13 6:13pm
Msg #464475

So the entire end of the document looked something like this (/s/ indicates a handwritten cursive signature)?

/s/ Joe Signer

____________

Joe Signer

Signed and delivered in my presence

/s/ NVLS Lady

_____________
Signing Agent

I administer an oath or take an acknowledgement for each document that needs one, so I wouldn't feel right about adding notarial language to a document that doesn't have it after the appointment is over. I would feel comfortable about signing a statement that a document was signed in my presence, as long as the language made it clear it wasn't a notarial act. I could even go along with delivery wording if it were a deed, as an act of a private citizen separate from taking the acknowledgement. But I don't know what it means to deliver an affidavit of survey. I suspect whoever wrote the wording doesn't know what it means either. So why would I want to sign something as a private citizen when it appears no one knows what it means?

Reply by NVLSlady/VA on 4/4/13 6:55pm
Msg #464480

It was actually worded as the entire notarial blah (personally appeared before me . . .) with the regular notary block (not "Signing Agent"). It looked just like tons of jurat/affidavit language I've notarized before - just instead of saying "acknowledged before me," it read Signed and delivered in my presence.

I could have easily signed as the agent; but this language really caught me off guard. I also agree with you about the oath at signing. But that's just it: I gave the oath (for all the affidavits same time) and did my seal, signature, then didn't actually READ the statement until I was checking over docs at home.

Reply by jba/fl on 4/4/13 7:02pm
Msg #464482

They signed it and then they delivered it (handed) to you for you to do your magic.

One of the things I learned many, many moons ago when I had difficulty reading and understanding a passage is that it becomes more clear when I read it aloud, as phrases. Sometimes these wordy and flowery sentences that lawyers love, esp. the older ones, just muddy the waters.

Reply by NVLSlady/VA on 4/4/13 8:23pm
Msg #464489

So True about reading Aloud! n/m

Reply by Saul Leibowitz on 4/4/13 10:18pm
Msg #464502

Re: So True about reading Aloud!

A professor of taxation told us to marki up the tax code or regs with a pencil mark whenever there was a piece of punctuation and then you can follow what it means; another version of reading aloud!
It does work.

Reply by VT_Syrup on 4/5/13 5:41am
Msg #464535

I have had acknowledgements that stated the signer signed in my presence. In as much as that was true, I used those acknowledgements with no alterations. It is the notary's duty to establish that the purported signer really did sign the document, and watching the signer sign is one way to carry out that duty. Since watching the signer sign was a an acceptable way to do my duty, I have no problem documenting it in the acknowledgement certificate. But it is not a notary's duty to observe whether or not a document was delivered, so I wouldn't want to put that in an acknowledgement certificate.

Reply by NVLSlady/VA on 4/5/13 8:25am
Msg #464539

<<"But it is not a notary's duty to observe whether or not a document was delivered, so I wouldn't want to put that in an acknowledgement certificate.">> LIKE

Reply by NVLSlady/VA on 4/5/13 8:40am
Msg #464540

Re: Check of Certificate Wording~ Under Penalty of

PERJURY!

Especially when this sentence is added after the ack: I certify under PENALTY OF PERJURY* under laws of ____________ that the foregoing paragraph is true and correct.

WITNESS my hand and official seal.

*Their caps, not mine