Posted by Eric Andrist on 8/16/13 6:57pm
Msg #480736

Notary Seal on non-signed document

I'm pretty sure I know the answer, but just want to make sure.

Doing a signing tonight with docs from Arizona. There's a form called "Notary Identification Statement." On it, it asks for the property address, signer's name, and space for me to fill in his ID information. Then it asks me to swear to it, sign it and then place my notary seal on the page.

Since I'm not notarizing anything, I assume I shouldn't be putting my seal on it, correct?

I'm in California, btw.

Reply by jba/fl on 8/16/13 7:07pm
Msg #480738

When I have those, I do as another (forgot who) suggested: I sign, print my name and my title is Witness. That removes me from notary, which I cannot seal as the BO is not signing anything. If it is one of the forms that the BO signs, then I do the full procedure.

You were correct - no need to second guess yourself here.

Reply by Eric Andrist on 8/16/13 7:08pm
Msg #480739

Thanks!

I figured better safe to ask than sorry. I appreciate the validation!

Reply by Alz on 8/16/13 7:10pm
Msg #480740

I'm pretty sure that your CA notary Handbook

confirms what you know to be the answer.

I'm not trying to be curt, but think that it is important to follow the rules of your Boss, the CA SOS. Also, consider using the orange search button, as it is your friend.

Lastly, some will tell you that this would have been discussed in the classroom. Good luck.

Reply by Ali/IL on 8/16/13 7:19pm
Msg #480741

Re: I'm pretty sure that your CA notary Handbook

I don't put my seal there

Reply by Yoli/CA on 8/16/13 7:39pm
Msg #480744

If they're asking you to place your seal on there as proof, just send them a copy of your commission.

Reply by GOLDGIRL/CA on 8/16/13 7:52pm
Msg #480748

Correct, Eric

Next time your confused about if you should or should not use your stamp, just remember: We notarize signatures. Period. If there's no signature for you to notarize, then you wouldn't use your stamp.

CA law forbids use of the stamp except to notarize a signature. (Another CA notary may cite your chapter and verse before this thread is over.)

A lot of lender/SS/TCs want notaries to leave their seal impression on riff-raff forms because they just want to see your seal. This is illegal for CA notaries to do Since no one is signing these forms, there's nothing to notarize and therefore no reason to stamp. And, of course, even if *you* are signing the form, such as the ID statement you mentioned, you never notarize your own signature.

Reply by MW/VA on 8/16/13 8:46pm
Msg #480752

Good explanation, GG. We often see those identity forms

where they ask for our "seal". I actually draw an "x" through that. Unless someone is signing the form, it is not a notarial act.

Reply by NVLSlady/VA on 8/16/13 8:52pm
Msg #480756

Re: Good explanation, GG. We often see those identity forms

I also do the 'X' thru (through), Marilyn!

Of course, lately I have seen the sneaky ID form versions where the signer MUST sign - and we have to notarize. That, in addition to the Patriot 2 ID mandatory can be a real pain.

Other day I got a Concealed Handgun permit as 2nd ID!

Reply by MW/VA on 8/16/13 8:56pm
Msg #480759

IMO it's poor interpretation of the Patriot Act to require 2

forms of ID. Some lenders do require it, and it's a PIA.
As I understand it, it's supposed to be 2 forms for non-citizens, and 1 form for citizens to comply with Patriot Act. The lender, of course, can set their own requirements. Those that have the gold make the rules. ;-)

Reply by NVLSlady/VA on 8/16/13 9:03pm
Msg #480760

Those that have the gold~

So Right. I recall when the Patriot form specifically said it was Unnecessary to fill out IF a copy of bo ID was incl in package.

Now I'm seeing all these "versions" of lender and title ID verification in same loan pckg, some where bo signature is Required. A backlash against the notary seal refusal??

Reply by Paul2_FL on 8/17/13 9:13am
Msg #480798

Be careful! Some of the Patriot Act Customer ID Forms

have a place for the the borrower to sign BUT the section they want you to sign and notarize is NOT for notarizing the borrower's signature but your own. I.e.; it starts with "I certify that I have reviewed blah blah blah. I personally just sign this as a Witness Signing Agent" only.

Reply by John/CT on 8/16/13 9:47pm
Msg #480766

I've seen these on a number of occasions, where I am asked to provide proof as a notary by completing a form and then affixing my notary seal. (Something I understand California notaries are barred from doing.) In my case, I affix my seal and then write the word "VOID" across it. Seems to work because I've never received any blow back on this approach.

Reply by Clem/CA on 8/16/13 10:06pm
Msg #480770

just write your commission # on it

Reply by Darlin_AL on 8/17/13 12:11pm
Msg #480808

I line-out Notary & write-in Notary Signing Agent for my title. No seal, except for the tricky ones where the borrower signs that it's his id as described above, which pretty much turns the form into an affid. (in my view) so I do notarize his signature on those. Sneaky & not the gov't form--so far.

Reply by NVLSlady/VA on 8/17/13 2:16pm
Msg #480815

<" tricky ones where the borrower signs that it's his id as described above, which pretty much turns the form into an affid.">

EXACTLY. In fact, the title of one such ID verification form was: Settlement Officer's Identification Affidavit

The "sneaky" act of adding the notarial stmt (ack) to the "I HEREBY CERTIFY" caused me to have to return for bo's signature recently 'cause I ran through and missed the tiny line for his signature - as normally I would just mark through "notary" and write Signing Agent and was mentioned.

They wanted our seal; now TC has "found a way!"

Reply by jnew on 8/17/13 11:06pm
Msg #480855

If there is a notarial certification on document?

I would only change the document with the permission of the customer. If they want me to sign a sworn statement that I established the identity of the borrowers, I will go out and have a notary public take my statement and notarize my signature on the document.