Posted by NC_Closer on 12/10/13 8:57am
Msg #495661

Truth about protecting consumer information

Seems all this hoopla stems from the new/old regulations over protecting consumers. Truth of the matter is we can be background checked and certified to death yet there has been zero instruction to us on how to properly protect consumer information. And even better there is no one out there who will supervise our procedures. It would be unreasonable to expect us to have the same secure facilities and computer equipment as a multi billion dollar bank. I have a cell phone, an Ipad and a home computer which call access my email. While they are all password protected is that really enough? And what about the people in our daily lives who enter our home or at our work. Many notaries access their documents from a work computer. Is anyone going to background check them?

If the lenders want to truly comply and safeguard their client's information then they should overnight the package directly to the borrower. All we should be provided with is the customer contact info and the tracking number. After the closing is completed we should be REQUIRED to seal the package in front of the borrowers (so no fax backs folks) and the borrower should have the option of allowing us to drop the package or they can. A form is completed in duplicate stating we were all present, the closing was completed, who took control of the seal package and the tracking number.

Seems like a very simple solution. And it puts the responsibility of protection where it belongs...with the Lender!

Reply by C. Rivera Chicago Notary Services on 12/10/13 9:37am
Msg #495664

you just gave a somewhat valid argument for Attorney Only

closings....

Reply by MW/VA on 12/10/13 10:28am
Msg #495669

I agree, Carrie. Just how far is anyone going to take this?

I've been doing signings for over 8 years & have never had one issue of a compromise of the borrower's info. This is so far out of control. What about postal workers, UPS drivers, etc.? They are all handling private & sensitive information. What about credit card bills that are mailed, mail from the ss office, etc.? To single out notaries is ludicrous. We would EXPECT notaries to handle info in a confidential way. This is all the workings of the XYZ who is scrambling to stay on top in a declining market, IMO.

Reply by NVLSlady/VA on 12/10/13 10:41am
Msg #495673

Re: I agree, Carrie. Just how far is anyone going to take this?

The title license (coming or not) won't take care of this issue of Privacy. That will be the next step, as Carrie implies: Atty only or settlement agent. Period. If consumers were told they have a Choice to close with who they want (and not who the lender selects), they might go for local vs. national TC; at least they'd know their NPI is in their own "neighborhood."

With online lending, the world got smaller . . . But the industry ramifications got larger IMO

Reply by C. Rivera Chicago Notary Services on 12/10/13 10:46am
Msg #495676

consumers actually HAVE choice of title lenders..its

ridiculous...its a form I've seen in the packet. Asking the BO if they want to choose the title the lender is currently using or choose one of their own.

I always thought this was a backwards a$$ way of giving the BO their choice!

I mean, hello, chances are they are ALREADY working with the lender's TC. I've not have one BO choose another TC in the last 7 yrs doing this job.

Reply by NVLSlady/VA on 12/10/13 10:59am
Msg #495682

Re: consumers actually HAVE choice of title lenders..its

Yes, they put the disclosure in there; but if borrowers really understood the far reaching implications (not just who can prepare your abstract of title), they might think much harder

Reply by MW/VA on 12/10/13 3:39pm
Msg #495720

The biggest selling point of NSA's was that it saved the

consumer money by getting a lower cost than if handled by an attorney. ;-)

Reply by C. Rivera Chicago Notary Services on 12/10/13 10:43am
Msg #495674

I think Postal Workers, well some, shouldn't be trusted with

mail. You hear all of those horror stories of retired workers having bags full in their crawls space or attic.

I believe that the delivery of mail in America is a dying form of personal service, and will soon be one of the things of the past. Maybe not in my lifetime, but I just don't see how paper mail delivery can survive?

Not to get off topic, but it makes you think about our work.

I believe its safe to say, that its inevitable that "e-notarization's", will eventually be the new norm or form of notarizations. Its just a matter of time before "personal appearance" is changed, like VA did, AND we all better be ready for this change. Link below: http://www.commonwealth.virginia.gov/notary/eNotary-faq.cfm

Get your PC's updated, webcams armed and your pretty faces ready. Oh have those updated tables and laptops with built in webcams. And don't forget your smart phones!

This IS going to be our future. Not totally sure if "ink" notarization's will be going away totally, but like our current US mail service, its going to be eventually "improved" for security and customer efficiency purposes.

Just my .02.

Reply by Notarysigner on 12/10/13 10:50am
Msg #495678

Good point.....BGC Webcams LOL n/m

Reply by C. Rivera Chicago Notary Services on 12/10/13 10:54am
Msg #495680

so NOT my point, but glad you were amused James. n/m

Reply by NVLSlady/VA on 12/10/13 10:53am
Msg #495679

Webcams: All homeowner needs is a home security system! lol

http://www.ftc.gov/news-events/press-releases/2013/09/marketer-internet-connected-home-security-video-cameras-settles

Reply by Notarysigner on 12/10/13 11:29am
Msg #495687

like this post, I still say wait to see what will happens

It all about nothing.

Reply by Marazz/AZ on 12/10/13 9:41am
Msg #495666

You're right, this isn't about protecting consumer info. This is about lenders being sent to the corner (proverbially) to atone for their past sins. The government doesn't have the stones to actually prosecute lenders (under the perfectly good laws we already have) so they're going to pass some new laws and new rules to show that they're actually doing something to protect people (aka voters). It's a bunch of political noise.

Notaries are getting caught up in it because we are easy targets, in a soft market. At the bottom of the food chain, and, because the bar to doing this work is fairly low (in the eyes of most lenders or title companies who are not concerned with finding the best signing agent but just the cheapest). We are on the wrong side of the current supply and demand situation. If you don't want to work for low fees or jump through whatever hoops they will probably not have trouble finding someone who will.

All you can do is go along to get along, or turn down requests with onerous conditions or fees and find something else to do to fill in the slow times. This too shall pass. But don't hold your breath for anyone in the government to actually do anything effective, or for lenders either.

Reply by Notarysigner on 12/10/13 9:54am
Msg #495667

Re: Truth about protecting consumer information Hooray!

Exactly why I said BS to the whole think.....no more loan signings for me. GNW or bust!

Reply by MW/VA on 12/10/13 3:40pm
Msg #495721

Well said. I appreciate your posts. Your info is spot on. n/m

Reply by NVLSlady/VA on 12/10/13 10:43am
Msg #495675

TS Privacy Agreement to follow Is JPMC the only lender who cares?)

Title and Closing Services and Vendor Management Services.
Any abstractor, notary, signing agent, closing agent or attorney or similar Provider whom Supplier shall select, retain, and supervise in accordance with Supplier’s ordinary and customary selection, retention and supervision practices shall be subject to all applicable provisions of the Master Agreement including the IT Security and Data Handler requirements referenced in Article 9 of the Master Agreement, but not be subject to JPMC’s prior written approval pursuant to Section 14.14 (Subcontractors) of the Master

Agreement except as follows:
Supplier shall not hire notary and signing agent subcontractors who have not either obtained certification by the National Notary Association (“NNA”) or have had a successful background check by the Supplier using materially similar criteria as the NNA screening process. If the NNA changes its screening criteria from those in effect on the date hereof as, shown on its website at www.nationalnotary.org, or if applicable law or regulations so require, JPMC may amend this requirement, provided however that JPMC shall not require that Supplier amend its acts or practices on a retroactive basis, except as required by NNA or applicable law or regulation.
Supplier will require all notary and signing agent Providers to execute the Supplier’s standard confidentiality agreement.

Reply by C. Rivera Chicago Notary Services on 12/10/13 10:49am
Msg #495677

NVLSLady...where's this from? n/m

Reply by NVLSlady/VA on 12/10/13 10:55am
Msg #495681

Confidential Info Agreement: Title Source

Agreement 8 pp (but they got us in there!)

Reply by C. Rivera Chicago Notary Services on 12/10/13 10:59am
Msg #495683

<<And even better there is no one out there who will supervise our procedures.>>

Well, if the SPeW grou has its way, THEY will be the ones who will be the kings of this. Just like the NNA has made their rounds making sure they are the ONLY source for BGC and listed on many SOS websites as a "resource" to go to renew or sign up as a notary public.

I'm sure the lenders that hired the NNA have confidence in them enough to push their agenda on all state legislatures as well. UNLESS, you all do something about it.

I suggest everyone file a quick online complaint with:

Federal Trade Commission
600 Pennsylvania Avenue, NW
Washington, DC 20580
Phone: 1-877-382-4357
Website: http://www.ftc.gov/
Complaint Form: https://www.ftccomplaintassistant.gov/

Reply by TeriW/CA on 12/10/13 1:09pm
Msg #495699

There is a new NON-PROFIT organization, by Signing Agents, for Signing Agents and I, and many others, are volunteering to help organize our industry and take control, instead of leaving it to the NNA, who is a FOR-profit business, just in it for the money.

It is American Notary Signing Agents. In just a short time, we already have over 600 NSA's signed up. Please join for FREE, an organization specifically with your best interests at heart! Volunteer if you have the time.

Non-profit papers have already been filed.

www.AmericanNotarySigningAgents.org

Reply by C. Rivera Chicago Notary Services on 12/10/13 1:15pm
Msg #495701

An anonymous group working for us? Not interested. n/m

Reply by JanetK_CA on 12/10/13 6:00pm
Msg #495739

I'm curious about one thing... Why do notaries have to register with ANSA before finding out what the goals and objectives are beyond some vague generalities? The lack of transparency with this group raises questions for some of us. Also raising questions is the fact that some of the releases and broadcast emails about this group are coming from someone whose primary business model appears to be providing services to notaries/"signing agents". Both issues appear to more closely parallel the business model of a certain often-spoken-of-here company, rather than that of the typical NSA.

I also understand that some signing services have been approached to make donations to cover the operating costs for this group. How does that enhance the credibility of this group that it's an organization "specifically with your best interests at heart"?

Forgive me for being a tad skeptical, but I've been around this industry long enough to have learned to ask lots of questions. Sometimes when I do (like with a signing service I haven't worked for before), things work out fine. Other times, not so much.

I would love to see a viable, respectable alternative to the "other guys", but that doesn't necessarily mean that the first presumed alternative is necessarily the best one. Before I'm ready to align myself with any group proposing change, I'd like to know about the leaders of the effort and what change they're wanting to accomplish. For any fellow Steven Covey fans, remember his sage advice to "start with the end in mind"...

I'm just sayin'...

Reply by C. Rivera Chicago Notary Services on 12/10/13 1:33pm
Msg #495705

NC Closer...your actually wrong about this...

<<yet there has been zero instruction to us on how to properly protect consumer information>>

The new CFPB Bulletin 2012-3, April 13, 2012 states what is expected of Service Providers

The CFPB now has examination authority over both its supervised institutions and their service providers, and has made it clear that it intends to use that authority.

This is why FNF and the like are pushing all of these forms on us to sign, bgc's, certifications, education, etc. Just so that they have the actual documentation on hand, to proof that their service providers are in fact compliant with the new rules and regs.

I believe as independent contractors, we NSA's must now have to step up our game in this profession and start making yourselves compliant, if you are not.

Not saying you should go with any particular company for bgc or certs, all I'm saying is get this done. Because if you're not bgc or certified, chances are you will NOT be hired to do any loan closings.

This is very real fact, that some of you doubters really have to consider as a reality.

Plus the good side of all of this compliance, is making sure you stand out against your competition. Marketing yourself and your business/company as being safe, consumer-compliant friendly is key to making money in this business.

We are service providers, and if you run an nsa business, then yeah, we should have our own standards in place, that fit with the CFPB rules and regs. If not to show our potential clients, TC and SS, but to also show our clients, just how we treat their confidential information, whether it be conducting loan signings or gnw.

It's is time to take your NSA business serious.

Reply by C. Rivera Chicago Notary Services on 12/10/13 1:35pm
Msg #495706

wish there was an 'edit' button..excuse typos, etc... n/m

Reply by NC_Closer on 12/10/13 4:38pm
Msg #495732

Cari...Not saying the requirements aren't established

and sure the CFPB has examination authority but in reality I have yet to receive a call from anyone requiring a site inspection of my office to ensure I have an appropriate shredder, locked file cabinets, secured electronics, etc. And you would think that perhaps just ONE question on all these certification exams would address proper handling of sensitive documents. At the very least the TC's should be required to grant access to a secured site for printing documents rather than just sending them in a pdf format. And the NNA folks are worried about my attire and whether I've been busted littering. You know if I were cited 3 times for littering and 1 time for swearing I would not be fit to close loans under the NNA arbitrary point system!

And speaking of that point system...clearly impedes small business owners from fair opportunity to make a buck. The only point system which should apply to this line of work is financial crimes and fraud.

Lastly, NC is fighting hard to return to an attorneys state.

Reply by Lee/AR on 12/10/13 5:50pm
Msg #495738

oh, no, Mr. Bill....

New test, certification, pay to play. Don't need any more ideas.

Reply by C. Rivera Chicago Notary Services on 12/11/13 9:29am
Msg #495773

Examination, means NOT TESTING, but actually physically

looking at a companies internal policy of handling consumer information, and making sure its in compliance with the CFPB rules.

Reply by JanetK_CA on 12/10/13 6:24pm
Msg #495742

Re: Cari...Not saying the requirements aren

I think you hit the nail on the head, Kim. You're pointing out that the emperor has no clothes and that all the BGCs and certifications are purely window dressing to create the appearance that something is being done to address the concerns of the CFPB.

Unfortunately, true to style, it seems like XYZ is using this as an opportunity to be self-serving for their needs and those of their title company cronies, rather than to seriously address the real issues, which you did a great job of itemizing. As much as we hate to admit it (and I'm right there with the rest of you on this), I believe these are the points that need to be tightened up when it comes to borrower privacy and data security.

BTW, I don't believe going attorney-only will solve all these problems, either. It will just raise borrower costs, imo.

Reply by jnew on 12/10/13 3:43pm
Msg #495722

CFPB Memo

I believe the memo stated that the third party servicers of lenders, including notaries need to know privacy procedures in order to protect consumer information. The signing agents have to have a policy for dealing with that protection and can be legally accountable as well as the lender-title signing authority who hires them. As far as I know, ( and have asked this question repeatedly ) there is no mandate or directive from the CFPB for procedures to be followed by NSA's in order to comply with this consumer protection. The memo goes on to state that the lenders are responsible for making sure that the signing agents comply with the directives that the lender's operate under. The SPW and its members are enforcing this by certifying their signing agents with the CSS designation. So, the background checks and exams and notary E & O are prerequisites to getting certified as a CSS. The bottom line is that the CSS's will be closing the loans for their members' loans and all other signing agents will not. If another group wants to do it differently, I would like to know how they will accomplish this without approval by the SPW group. If any new group is not working directly with lenders on this, I think that their efforts will be futile, unless they operate under the same guidelines as the SPW and get their approval.

Reply by CarolF/NC on 12/10/13 6:48pm
Msg #495744

I like it and why is it that when a borrower is asked to

find their own notary, all those BS documents like the notarial evidence form, and borrowers having to initial on every page is not needed. You witness like 6 to 10 documents and you are done. No need to print, explain the documents to borrower, verify the closing or ship. Are all those documents in there just to drive us crazy? I really don't understand. I love it when borrowers find me. I'm not responsible for anything but a few pages and I make the same money. And if you think the attorneys handle things better than notaries, no they don't. My attorney didn't explain any documents to me but the HUD and said the purpose of the deed. He said, sign, sign, sign and he didn't show me all pages of the package. My friend's attorney introduced himself and left. His clerical staff notarized the documents.

Reply by ReneeK_MI on 12/11/13 5:37am
Msg #495768

GLBA Privacy & Security Training RIGHT HERE ON N/R

There is (and has been for many years) an instructional GLBA compliance training module freely available on Notary Rotary's Welcome page (log OUT and then go to the Welcome page - it is right below the NPBC logo). The 40 page module provides a wealth of information and instruction on how to protect the consumer's privacy.

I mention this in response to the OP's statement:

"...yet there has been zero instruction to us on how to properly protect consumer information."

Reply by C. Rivera Chicago Notary Services on 12/11/13 9:28am
Msg #495772

I'm not sure WHY some of you are not getting it...

We are considered SERVICE PROVIDERS. We are third party service providers in some respects, depends on who hires us.

We have been "officially" labeled as such under the new mortgage rules. I would think, that we would have to follow and comply the same rules, like the lenders and now tc's, only we as independent business owners, would need to create our own policies and procedures on how we are going to dispose of consumer information.

Since there is NOTHING out there specifically for us, we are going to have to come up with our own, for our respective businesses.

There are some TC's that have taken this step, and are basically telling us not only what to wear and not to wear, but also HOW TO DISPOSE of consumer financially information. Its been like this for years, but NOW, these same companies are practically shoving this information down our throats.

I'm taking this information, and creating my own company's rules and procedures, on how me and my staff are properly keeping consumer information confidential, encrypted, and the disposal of.

I would suggest, that ALL NSA's do the same. There is also the XYZ that has tons of information on how to treat consumer/borrower information as well. Use those tips. But overall, if you run an actual NSA business, and as independent contractors, we all are, then we alone are responsible in making sure we keep up with the latest rules and regulations in this industry!

If you consider yourself, self-employed, and do not have a website, and just register yourself with various SC and TC's, you STILL have to be up to speed on all of the latest changes.

Otherwise, you are NOT going to get any work.

Just my .02

Reply by ReneeK_MI on 12/11/13 10:40am
Msg #495777

I'm not sure WHY ...

... you repeat the O/P's notion that there is "NOTHING out there specifically for us" when there is, right here on N/R.

As for your mentioning of preparing our own policies and procedures - that is precisely what is pointed out in the GLBA Compliance Training. The entire purpose of this module is to spell out specifically how this applies to the NSA, what procedures and policies they might consider and why.

I'm also not sure why you would suggest gleaning XYZ for this same information freely available right here.

Reply by ikando on 12/11/13 10:57am
Msg #495781

Re: Not getting it

Cari,

The way I've interpreted all the bru-ha-ha is just as you suggest, we NSAs need to have our own policies for compliance, in writing and practiced. Training, testing, BGC, should be, in my opinion, at the choice of the NSA, since the NSA is the one paying for it, as long as the companies that provide them follow the same requirements. And that means ALL government mandates, not just some interpretations re-written to provide an income stream from them.

Reply by NC_Closer on 12/11/13 5:06pm
Msg #495823

Renee...thanks for pointing that out.

Good for Harry for providing that info.

Now, going back to my original point, who is actually policing the NSA's to ensure proper care is taken? No one. Mortgage lenders, broker offices, title companies, etc. are all subject to spot inspections and audits to ensure compliance by a governing entity. In my opinion it's a huge leap of faith on behalf of every TC & SS who sends out sensitive information to thousand of notaries across the county.

I will say again, I believe it would be in the best interest of the borrowers and us for the lenders, ET. AL. to limit use of electronic submission and return to overnighting packages.

Reply by jba/fl on 12/12/13 7:45am
Msg #495869

The flaw here is that

the notary is still getting the information sent to them. Sometimes packages are not signed, which means either shred, compost or send them back if they don't get gleaned for info in the meantime.

No, the individual's method of accountability and proper care is important. That is what the issue is here.

As for the composting: just wondering who stiffened up at that mention.