Posted by Susan DeMarco on 2/25/13 8:19am
Msg #457631

Title Source & The Low Ballers

In the past 2 weeks I have received 9 signing requests from JMT - all were offers for $50.00 to do a Quicken loan signing - several times after declining the offer - the caller explained to me that a Quicken loan only takes 15 minutes - I explained to the caller that no one can quantify how long a signing will take as there are factors that are unknown until one gets to the table ie will the borrowers choose to actually read what they are signing, choose to discuss with each other etc.

I also received 7 request from Nations Direct for anywhere from a low 0f $40.00 to a high of $60.00 - again all Quicken loans - an additional 3 calls were for structured settlements for 35.00. Out of curiousity - on each of these requests - I told the caller that I did not complete a background check with any company - to which the callers replied "they did not require it unless you register with Nations Direct. They apparently find their notaries on NotaryXXX.

Someone from TSI posts on this board and must be aware of the fees that JMT and Nations offers for loan signings and is obviously okay with signing agents that are willing to work for such fees.

Reply by Lee/AR on 2/25/13 8:30am
Msg #457634

Just say No and keep on doing it. 15 min. Quicken--not! n/m

Reply by 101livescan on 2/25/13 8:35am
Msg #457635

We have a new policy here at NR, thanks to mewcomer Mike/Il when you're offered these low fees. Counter with $400, or $500, and when they say that's ridiculous, you say, so is your offer, now let's talk seriously about a better fee.

Mike/Il recommends that he will verify their rating on SC and see if he can help them out...upon which the caller hangs up on him! end of conversation. Moving on...

I have never worked for JMT and I don't think I've worked for Nations Direct in over ten years before they became so cheap. Time to dump em. A complete waste of time and oxygen...

Running down the hill. Have a great EOM everyone.

Reply by CarolF/NC on 2/25/13 8:44am
Msg #457636

TS is now ok with notaries only being paid $85 for standard

refis, reverse mortgages, etc. with no extra pay for large packages, extra travel or fax backs so yes, I guess they are good with that.

Reply by janCA on 2/25/13 8:47am
Msg #457637

Susan, go to the TS website and sign up directly with the company.

I work with both an SS and directly with TS on the Quicken loans. My fee is TWICE the amount when I work directly with TS and I'm not talking about $100, $125 or $150. I also do many of their CHASE loans. That said, your goal is to work directly with the title company in the first place. You have to figure out whether or not the $50 fee is worth your time. More than likely JMT is receiving the other half of that fee, and probably more. Again, remember, SS's work on volume and many expect the SA's fee to be cut to the quick because of their desperation to get the contract with the title company.

Reply by Julie/MI on 2/25/13 9:15am
Msg #457641

Some signing services pay $95 for Title source

and you bet JMT and the other low ballers are making top $$$ off of your backs. The ARE NOT getting less $$$ than other signing services that pay $95.

Reply by Cam/CA on 2/25/13 9:21am
Msg #457642

Re: Yes indeed Julie, shame that the low ballers get some of

orders, it would be better if they all went to the higher paying signing services.

Reply by Linda_H/FL on 2/25/13 9:48am
Msg #457645

I've never had a Quicken loan at 15 minutes - not even

30 or 45 - mine are all about an hour - by the time I'm done identifying, notarizing, etc etc - I allow at least an hour at the table.

Reply by CarolF/NC on 2/25/13 10:46am
Msg #457654

And..Quicken is infamous for not cleaning up title, so add

another hour for collateral ID verification and adding the AKA etc. in states where that is allowed.

Reply by Julie/MI on 2/25/13 12:15pm
Msg #457670

Linda an hour? for a quicken??

Really?

Maybe florida has more docs to notarize, but all I have is a mortgage, the signature name affs 1 or 2 and that's about it. about 70 pages, maybe a few others of in a trust.

I had a quicken Loan supervisor yesteday and was done in 7 mins.

Reply by Linda_H/FL on 2/25/13 12:41pm
Msg #457678

I'm talking total, including id stuff and all n/m

Reply by desktopfull on 2/26/13 1:45am
Msg #457845

20-30 min. tops, out the door and drop on way back to office n/m

Reply by Susan DeMarco on 2/25/13 1:31pm
Msg #457690

Re: Linda an hour? for a quicken??

You must have a super - duper fast printer & car to have printed and driven and verified ID and signed - checked docs to make sure no signatures or initials were missed.

You are my HERO !!!!

Reply by Susan DeMarco on 2/25/13 1:37pm
Msg #457691

7 Min - Takes me 3 minutes to get from car to the door N/M n/m

Reply by CarolF/NC on 2/25/13 7:34pm
Msg #457801

Re: 7 Min - Takes me 7 minutes just to ID and fill n/m

Reply by CarolF/NC on 2/25/13 7:36pm
Msg #457802

Re: 7 Min - Takes me 7 minutes just to ID and fill

In journal. Most of my borrowers can't sign pages in less than 30
minutes. Maybe it's a southern thing why we are slow.

Reply by Notarysigner on 2/25/13 10:19am
Msg #457650

Re: Title Source & The Low Ballers 15 min Quicken loan

I think it would be very interesting to find out what is the procedure for doing a 15 min Quicken Loan. Maybe Quicken or some enterprising SS marketeer can produce a training video for us on how the accomplish this so they only have to pay $50 - $60.

Reply by Linda_H/FL on 2/25/13 10:47am
Msg #457655

And present everything, explain what we're supposed to

explain AND comply with all the notarial recordkeeping requirements

Reply by Julie/MI on 2/25/13 12:34pm
Msg #457677

Re: And present everything, explain what we're supposed to

So do I.
The only slower part is that I pull their id verification form first, so that's done. every other time, they are well versed, check, if necessary, is already filled out.

Reply by Donna McDaniel on 2/25/13 11:47am
Msg #457666

Bad business decision, IMO

Quicken is very proud of their reputation for exceptional service. If JMT is paying $50.00 per signing, they are running the risk of losing the client to an SS that only hires quality notaries.

Reply by janCA on 2/25/13 12:06pm
Msg #457667

Re: Quickens

you have to remember, on a Quicken, the borrowers are sent their copy ahead of time and have had a chance to review. By time you get there, they've cleared any discrepancies with their loan officer. And, there's only the Deed and the Signature/Name Afd that has signatures to be notarized. I think, only on two occasions, I had a Grant Deed.

You can start explaining, but they usually just want to sign. My Quicken signings usually last 20-30 minutes.

Reply by Lee/AR on 2/25/13 12:18pm
Msg #457671

Agree, Jan. Still longer than '15 min.'

And I've had some that go way longer for a variety of reasons beyond my control. So...on an average, 15 minutes is far from accurate.

Reply by Doris_CO on 2/25/13 1:54pm
Msg #457694

Re: Agree, Jan. Still longer than '15 min.'

I just had my first Quicken signing earlier this month and yes, it took about 45 minutes for a 70 page package. The borrower hadn't received any docs, so was totally unprepared and asked lots of questions.

Reply by CopperheadVA on 2/25/13 2:23pm
Msg #457695

Re: Agree, Jan. Still longer than '15 min.'

And they don't always look at the docs even when they receive them!

I have had Quickens take anywhere from being back inside my car in 15 minutes for single borrower who had reviewed everything, to one hour+ for borrowers who nit picked every word on DOT and didn't look at docs until right before I got there.

Reply by JanetK_CA on 2/25/13 6:33pm
Msg #457775

Re: Agree, Jan. Still longer than '15 min.'

Right. I'd say with more than 75% of the Quicken loans I've done, either they hadn't yet received the documents or they hadn't yet had a chance to look at them. I still prefer them to any other package, but like with any other signing, you never know what you're about to walk into.

Reply by JanelWI on 2/26/13 5:51am
Msg #457854

Re: Agree, Jan. Still longer than '15 min.'

Same here. Many times they don't read the packages when they do get them. I have even had where I was told it was email docs and I get to the table and the sealed signing package and borrower package are already there and are identical to what I printed out. 30-45 minutes if chit chat is kept to a minimum.

I don't know if I just have the right face or what....but the minute I walk through the door for any signing it is always the same, they offer you coffee, tea, or water....they ask me how long I have been doing this...they say they are surprised that they send someone to their house, even though I prep for ID's when I confirm the appointment, nine times out of ten they are like "oh, I forgot" so I sit and wait for those, they ask how did you get into this business blah blah blah, then the paperwork has issues like the address or incorrect county names....there are so many things that can slow it down at the table...I could go on.....so 15 minutes really emphasizes their ignorance, or it emphasizes that we really have zero importance to them for the overall process. They make it sound like getting signatures are important, but at the end of the day it is only work...$XX.

I have even had people with severe shaking and the signing took over an hour....this is what we get paid for, to not only navigate the consumer through their package, but to represent the lender, title etc...in a professional way so the borrowers also feel comfortable with someone coming to their home to witness and sign paperwork. That is the difference, nine out of ten we go to their home, not a sterile office. When you deal directly with people in this respect it will not now or ever be just "sign here".

So either they want a trained, certified background screened professional document signing agent or just a notary. Because we have to know much more than just the mechanics of the job itself.

Doesn't it feel great to see our fee shrink before our eyes the minute they try to define our entire existence on how many pages we print and how many times we place our seal on a page? I take the notarial law test every four years in WI and not a stitch of it covers loan signing.....that, is something else entirely yet they try to blanket it all as "notary services" to justify their low ball fee. Last time I checked, "Notaries" were also important ministerial officials. Is this their way of also saying....Notaries are not really worth crap either? We need you, but we don't need you? Seriously?

All one has to do is read their blooming instructions to see otherwise. So, it is their perception of our role in this industry that had to change. However, for monetary reasons it never will...so it is up to us to teach them how we want to be compensated and be consistent and united about the common fact that we are more than just our notary stamp. We are business owners, they are contracting with us for a particular expertise not unlike many B2B transactions.

Would you ask a dental hygienist to fix your teeth or would you require the actual dentist to do that? So why would a lender who then contracts a settlement agent for qualified reasons, who then enlists a signing service to find a qualified signing agent send a notary to do what a professional document signing agent does?

For me, the notary commission is the tool I use to get me in the door; it is my knowledge and credentials and experience in finance, real estate and loan documents as well as over 20 years of direct customer service, great communication and interpersonal skills to name a few that makes me qualified to sit at the table and navigate the borrowers through their loan package and also direct them to the individuals they need for further instruction. I make it my job to know, this is my entire livelihood, and believe me, when I have worked title direct, they notice as well and I have worked with some great title companies.

I don't contract with someone to tell them...."you don't deserve that much" I am contracting for a particular expertise that I need or don't have, or can't be there to perform myself....In no way does that qualify me to tell them what their job is worth or can I possibly know what their overhead is. However, I can shop to make sure I am getting the best value. So what determines value our case?

This is why they prey on the newbie. $20 bucks for a stamp and in WI, $0.50 per notarized signature...so offer them $50 and they will be jumping for joy! They blow smoke about the GLBA and having background checks...obviously, it is all bull because it comes down to fee every time.

Some title companies low ball for the contract, low ball again for a signing service to find a notary...low ball again with a clueless notary......lowball, lowballers.....lowest of them all....us.

Sorry, the keyword here is "SOME" because there is good and bad in every industry from title to signing service and I have had the ongoing pleasure to work with many great title and signing services! anyway...how about some title companies stand their ground regarding the valuable service they provide instead of punishing us for it and using some bottom feeding signing services to take even more off the top for just making a phone call, when they can call us directly.

Reply by Tudi/CA on 2/25/13 6:20pm
Msg #457769

Re: Bad business decision, IMO

Good point, Donna. I recently read somewhere that a lot of pay checks are riding on the line with the signing agent. If the signing agent messes up on the signing, the loan may not go through. That means no pay checks for the people who spent their time handling the loan BEFORE it went to the notary. I think it's worth asking these low-ball companies if saving a couple of bucks by hiring a cheap notary is worth taking the risk of the loan not closing.