Posted by Linda_H/FL on 3/23/13 10:33pm
Msg #462732

Notary conducted my Reverse Mortgage Closing Friday

1. Did not print docs - title sent docs to me, I printed two sets and I reviewed HUD with hubby - we then asked LO questions before notary got to closing (LO attends). I also set up the return package for UPS. The fee for her on the HUD is over $100

2. Notary did not present documents to us - gave us the signature pages to sign and never told us what we were signing - how did we know? I looked at bottom of page to see what doc was referenced - signed and told my husband.

3. Notary did not notarize in front of us - turned notary certs sideways in package to go back and notarize later.

I'm gritting my teeth. We did ours in the middle of a busy, errand-filled day not to mention my OWN signings where my husband was hired as a witness. I just was in no mood to get confrontational with her.

But if this loan doesn't fund for any reason - I'ma gonna be screaming...

Just my little 5 minutes of fame on the OTHER side of the table.

Reply by Shoshana/AZ on 3/23/13 11:16pm
Msg #462737

I got confrontational with my notary when we had our RN closing. LO was upset too.

Reply by desktopfull on 3/23/13 11:38pm
Msg #462740

Just curious as to why you let the notary leave without completing the notarizations. I would have demanded she do the job correctly or asked her to leave and found another notary to notarize the docs and returned the docs to title myself with an explanation of the first notary's improper handling of the signing.

Reply by Marian_in_CA on 3/23/13 11:51pm
Msg #462741

Doesn't Florida law require that the notarizations be done in your presence?

I would have been ALL over that. I would have demanded she do them before leaving.

Reply by GOLDGIRL/CA on 3/24/13 12:15am
Msg #462743

I thought Florida absolutely had a law requiring notaries to complete everything before leaving signer .....?

Reply by Shoshana/AZ on 3/24/13 12:24am
Msg #462744

Our notary didn't even ask my husband to sign her journal, brought the bor copies on disc (without asking if it was ok, and was about to take a picture of our IDs without asking if we could make copies. LO was disgusted. TC fired her! LOL!

Reply by 101livescan on 3/24/13 8:56am
Msg #462753

Wow, do you even know who the notary is, did you see her commission stamp, did she leave her card? Does she know you're a notary? That would have been her first clue to do a first class job and follow the ground rules. Did you give a thumb print?

YIKES! I would have insisted she complete the documents in front of me. And I would have then made a copy of the signed Notes and TIL, and signed and sealed DOTs at least.

Contrary to my recent rant where I said I had performed my last RM signing recently after a situation where the daughter and the LO were trying to "push" on an RM for mom who was completely out to lunch after a stroke five years ago left her unable to connect the dots, I accepted one in Montecito last week. The guy inherited his parents home, he had gone through all his and their cash and needed to take money out. It's the last hurrah.

The borrower noticed on the first last page of the package that the LO was being paid $27K for a broker's fee and he went ballistic and asked me if that was negotiable and why was the first he'd heard about it. I said, why don't you call your loan officer. Well, of course, it wasn't the first time he was notified about it, but he was embarrassed about it in front of me and felt he was being victimized. We closed any way.

I do think that his is indeed my final RM signing. Too much time, too much drama, too much for me. Especially at month end, but it was $150. Shoulda been more.

Reply by Linda_H/FL on 3/24/13 9:23am
Msg #462755

To respond to some...and maybe some better info

I close RM's for this LO all the time - he picks his notary - me. So when it came to MY RM, he had to get another notary - he called her - she works at a bank.

I did see her stamp...from a well-known organization.

It's my belief that she did not present the docs because she was told I was a notary and knew the packages backward and forward...she actually appeared nervous.

And again, like I said, I had too much to do and too much on my mind to get confrontational with her. I just would have expected her to at least give the title of the doc - nope..just the signature pages. But again, I'm thinking that's because she was told I knew the package. Problem with this is if she went through the package to check for missed ANYTHING, we were gone - she dismissed us before she did her quality control.

I'm not one to make a scene over something like this - that's just not me. Unless, of course, my loan is held up for any reason, then I will be screaming.

I don't think she puts herself out as a mobile notary - she was just helping out our loan officer, who really had no other notary to call for this.

Reply by Julie/MI on 3/24/13 9:27am
Msg #462756

As I've said a million times, I'm a closer not a notary.

If you are at a signing you have a notary that is there to witness your signature. Period.
You had the docs a head of time and and LO, so no problem there. the UPL phobs, should be happy she didn't explain any of the docs!

If you are at a closing, the "closer" will highlight the docs and then notarize your signature.I see you called it a closing in your headline but that you had to do your own "signings" later.

So what harm is incurred by you if they don't sign fill out the certs and stamp and sign in front of you? I'm not saying she's right, I'm just asking what doom will happen?

I don't see a problem accept that she should have charged at least $150 and you chose to print, right?

I'm always amused at the "my own closing" bantering and complaints and I guess everyone funding and the sky didn't fall.

I'm NOT picking on you Linda, sometimes a typed post cannot convey me raising my eyebrow and just wondering why people pick apart their own notaries.

Reply by Linda_H/FL on 3/24/13 9:48am
Msg #462760

Well, Julie, maybe you didn't cull from my

posts that (a) closing/signing procedure went right out the window; and (b) Florida notary law was not adhered to.

I didn't say anything about her not explaining docs - I said she didn't even PRESENT docs - she gave us the signature pages.

By not notarizing in front of me it's a blatant violation of Florida notary law.

And, according to the HUD...she charged more than $150.

Reply by Suzibelle01 on 3/24/13 9:56am
Msg #462761

Re: Well, Julie, maybe you didn't cull from my

If this notary didn't follow Florida's rules during the signing then you should of haulted the signing and reported him/her. This type of notary needs to be weeded out of the system. If she was this laxed in her notary duties at the table who knows what she did with your paperwork and information after she left.

Reply by janCA on 3/24/13 9:57am
Msg #462762

I also don't do RM's any longer, for many of the same reasons Cheryl stated. In my opinion, they aren't worth the pay that is offered.

When I did do them, back in the day, one certain company, I believe it was Heritage, can't quite remember, had the same LO at every signing. He would call me, bring the docs and explain the docs to the borrowers. I was simply there to notarize and the fee was always $150. I always notarize at the table. By time I leave, that set of docs is ready to be dropped.

On other RM's the borrowers would always be told that the LO would be attending the signing. They NEVER did. And it was always impossible to contact them; they were never around. Basically, it was just a lie being told to these people.

When we refied a rental property four or five years ago, the notary is top notch in this area, I did not want the docs explained to me, I knew what I was signing, but it did bother me that not one notarization was filled out in front of me.

I disagree that I am a closer. The loan isn't closed until funded and that is the settlement agent's job. We simply present the final docs, give a small explanation of that document and get the signature/s. I have no problem saying I am a notary signing agent.

Reply by MW/VA on 3/24/13 12:05pm
Msg #462767

Congrats on your RM. I never understand when notaries

are closing their own transactions & don't request a notary they know can do the job. I'm not sure that I agree with letting someone walk in to a set-up. How would you feel if you were in their position.
I know it's been discussed many times about notarizing at the table. I don't & choose to stay 100% focused on the borrowers. I always double check the pkg. & do my stuff then. I write neatly, & want to make sure there's no errors or a smeared stamp, etc.
My position has always been that I'm there to witness their signatures, and they don't have to witness mine.
BTW, when I refi'd last year I chose to close at the tc. I really didn't want another notary in my biz, and didn't want to deal with a random selection.

Reply by Linda_H/FL on 3/24/13 12:12pm
Msg #462769

Marilynn...I did request a specific notary, which

title had no problem with - unfortunately he couldn't make it - so the LO called a notary he knew. And I'm thinking the LO did tell her I was a notary and closed his loans - so she *wouldn't* feel like she'd been set up.

"My position has always been that I'm there to witness their signatures, and they don't have to witness mine"

Although I kind of agree with this - it *is* FL law - and that's what we have to follow.

BTW - further research shows she doesn't put herself out as a signing agent - at least not that I can find. She just works part-time at the bank.

Reply by MW/VA on 3/25/13 7:52am
Msg #462873

Yes, I do understand. I'm also aware that it is best to

complete the notary work at the table. It just doesn't work well for me. As you said, she doesn't claim to be a NSA, and in this case they probably felt no explanation of the docs was necessary. Again, congrats on the RM. :-)

Reply by notaryKing on 3/24/13 11:53pm
Msg #462861

Re: Congrats on your RM. I never understand when notaries

I wanted to chime in on this topic, I'm new to this end of the lending business but have worked as an LO and for a title company, only in the last few years have I done this and joined NR only a few months back. I was lucky enough with my old LO buddies and the title co owner I know, I have a steady flow, I've only blasted the marketing end of this recently, I wanted to get off the ground.

That said, I'm closing in on around 300 closings as the notary end. Over 1000 as an LO or TC rep.

I work rural areas, I'm in some not so up to date places sometimes if you feel me. There are times when I do not stamp at the closing. I will sign my name where it needs to go, date, my exp date, and move on. They know who I am before I even get there; then when there, I introduce myself, I have a card, I explain what the doc is as we go, it's easy for me, I like doing it. I've been in a place where a dog went bat**** every time I stamped one night. So here and there, yes, I don't stamp or write something to not waste the borrower's time. He doesn't need to watch me do my job. If it's somewhere I feel I need to hit the trail ASAP, it may go that way. That's at in home's only. I wear clothing with my company logo embroidered on it to in homes to be/seem more professional. If I'm in a bank, or RE office, etc, sure, everything as it should go. I feel the borrowers' home is kind of on the casual side anyway, they want the thing to fund and as "not" notaries, they couldn't care less if I stamp then or later really. Some times I've been pushed out of the house, people want me gone ASAP so they can get about their day. I get that. Just last week, this lady was making St Patricks day candy for her kids as she signed, walked to stove, signed, walked to fridge, and co borrower wasn't even there when I arrived, and I had closing after that one that they were making me late to. Guess which treatment they got? Individuals I've learned, do not take this too seriously. All have already bought or refi'd too many times in the past to care.

The biz side......every time without a doubt. The other person may be a notary or know how things go(as did here) and feel like they were a hack notary. I feel explaining the docs on what they need to know is more important on them worrying about how I do my job.

And embarrassingly I will admit, all the closings I've done, I went to an in home and left my stamp in my briefcase at work. So factor that in. I felt like a newbie, but told borrower about it, didn't care

Just my two cents

Reply by Carolyn Bodley on 3/25/13 7:51am
Msg #462872

Not stamping at the signing ...

King,
**I will sign my name where it needs to go, date, my exp date, and move on. ... I don't stamp or write something to not waste the borrower's time. He doesn't need to watch me do my job.**

You have a card and wear clothing with embroidered logo to make yourself appear professional, but you don't stamp or write at the table. Many, many years ago, there was a thread where someone did as you do -- they ended up in a really bad car accident and the hospital. Family members could have simply dropped the package in the FedEx or UPS box, but without stamps and sigs, they couldn't. What if it is not just a car accident but worse -- actually a fatality?

Reply by notaryKing on 3/26/13 12:37am
Msg #463028

Re: Not stamping at the signing ...

I didn't say I didn't write, of course, I sign as I go along. I didn't mean for it to sound like an everyday occurance, just for one error on my part, and for those who make me feel I'm interrupting their day(if anyone else gets that.)

I never meant to sound like a hack or not a pro, but when I'm in a trailer for a signing and the smell of pee is getting to me, or June Cleaver can't leave the prioritize a $500k loan over her Xmas cookies, I've been in this pushing 15 years, I'll be ok.

Reply by MistarellaFL on 3/25/13 8:20am
Msg #462874

I fill in everything I can prior to the appt.

And all I have to do at the table is sign and stamp.
I don't know if your state requires you to sign and stamp in the presence of the signer, but even if not addressed by your state, it is the best practice.

Reply by JanetK_CA on 3/25/13 10:22pm
Msg #463008

Agree with Misty 100% - required or not, "best practice" imo n/m

Reply by Gregory/CA on 3/24/13 6:24pm
Msg #462832

Linda, Just Curious. Did you get a print fee? :-)

Usually, when I see that someone is a paralegal or notary, I ask at the beginning of the process if they want an explanation of the documents or document identification & sign. I've had it both ways.

Also, I've had a few that said, "I need to start giving the oath." That surprises me considering we are required by law to provide it. I know my last refi, she did not put me under oath.