Posted by Susan/CA on 9/20/13 12:50pm
Msg #485331

Just called Service Link

I called Service Link this morning. It is clear that every loan agent in the U.S. is slow, however, I just wanted to re-assure myself that I am still active in their database.

Normally even during the slowest of times I get a few calls a month at the very least from Service Link. As it turns out I am fine and still active in their database. The problem is that they have too many agents in Los Angeles County that are working for 45.00! It makes me sick to my stomach. The girl in scheduling told me if I want to get more work I can call anytime and lower my fees. She said there are a ton of notaries in the county that are working for 45.00-50.00. This combined with slow times is very sad.

I ran into one of S.L. local agents at a signing (the borrowers were refinancing 2 homes). The other agent was early, very arrogant and in my area. He was retired and his wife was working. He clearly doesn't need to worry about slow times as he can rely on his wife's income. He said he was constantly getting texts, emails and calls from S.L. (I have not received a text in months). We chatted a little more and he told me he had a special ink pad and journal but said he would not tell me where he bought it. I don't remember what made the ink pad special. Maybe it was clear? It just floored me that he refused to tell me where he bought it. I really didn't care but that showed me what kind of character this man had. Very rude and arrogant. Acted like the borrowers owed him something for showing up. These are the kinds of notaries that will ruin this business. Notaries who don't have to worry about doing this to survive. They have a 2nd source of income or young notaries that live with their parents, or have several roommates.

I'm sorry, I just had to vent. Even though over the last 13 years of doing this business I have seen fees fall dramatically I still have a hard time accepting it. And S.L. has been one of my favorites over the years. Very sad times for all of us. Too bad everyone didn't stick together to keep fees reasonable.

Off my soap box now...sorry to be redundant regarding fees...

Susan

Reply by BobbiCT on 9/20/13 1:14pm
Msg #485337

$45 part-timer. Look on the TAX bright side ..

Unless they've checked it out with their CPA or have a good business plan:

Thank about these people discovering next year that they have to pay state and federal income tax on this money. Also, as someone who was collecting Social Security posted ages ago when audited, the deductions for mileage, paper, etc. turned their "low gross profit business" into a "hobby" and the deductions weren't allowed.

Reply by Marian_in_CA on 9/20/13 1:37pm
Msg #485342

Re: $45 part-timer. Look on the TAX bright side ..

It's not even just a part-time. They're the ones using their employer's resources for printing, too.... likely without their knowledge or permission.

Reply by Darlin_AL on 9/20/13 1:57pm
Msg #485347

Re: $45 part-timer. Look on the TAX bright side ..

Unless they have their own computer, it's a violation of the GLB Act. There's other requirements also; notary has to have private control over all documentation vis a vis storage, shredding, etc. If someone is using a company computer or their email on that computer for this, imolo, they are in violation of federal regulations.

Reply by Marian_in_CA on 9/20/13 2:56pm
Msg #485358

Re: $45 part-timer. Look on the TAX bright side ..

Not necessarily. The GLBA has nothing to do with the notary directly. GLBA compliance depends on the rules of each individual lender and the privacy regulations they have in place. A lot of people don't understand that. The GLBA doesn't have specific rules per se.... the rule is that each individual bank, lender, etc. must have a privacy protection plan in place and they are responsible to complying with said plan. Not all plans are alike.

For example...notary background checks are NOT required by the federal government. They may be required by individual lenders, or subcontractors they work with as part of their plan, but it is NOT a specific federal requirement.

Reply by Darlin_AL on 9/20/13 4:41pm
Msg #485374

Marian, GLBA does trickle down to me; it's in every contract

I have signed as vendor. As an example, if I tossed "extra" copies of docs w/personal info into general trash w/out shredding AND it was discovered that's how the ring of thieves got their info--the lender would come under fire for hiring whoever hired me. Plus me. Violations are punishable by the feds, that's all I'm sayin' (Had to study & pass tests on GLBA for 7 years to handle my end of the compliance for our bank department.)

Reply by Marian_in_CA on 9/20/13 5:00pm
Msg #485379

Re: Marian, GLBA does trickle down to me; it's in every contract

Right...but what I'm saying it that any specific rules or requirements are not those of the Feds, but of the companies that hire you...and they vary greatly from company to company.

I'm not saying they don't apply to us. I'm saying that we cannot directly put a blanket statement that to do X is a violation of the GLBA, when it may or may not be. Many lenders will say the Feds require this or that... when they don't actually require it, they just blame the GLBA because the misunderstand how it works. Specific privacy protocols are up to each individual lender/bank.

Reply by BobbiCT on 9/21/13 9:49am
Msg #485425

Well stated Marian and Darlin ...

As someone who works with and for lawyers in all legal fields, not everything is "the law" for a sub-sub-contractor vendor. It is the hiring vendor's interpretation of "the law" and what that vendor requires to CY its A ... aka pass on the liability to as many subcontractors as possible in the event of a claim so its insurance company isn't the only coverage to be pulled into the money pit.

Reply by pdl/cali on 9/20/13 3:51pm
Msg #485363

Re: $45 part-timer. Look on the TAX bright side ..

I have not heard from SL in a while .
It's been about a year.

Reply by Darlin_AL on 9/20/13 2:00pm
Msg #485349

Susan--rec'd a text order at my normal fee....

don't give up! As we all have been musing, when the cheap notaries mess-up, they'll come back to you.

Reply by Bill/Indy on 9/20/13 3:57pm
Msg #485364

Please don't lump all part-timers into the same category. There are many of us retired folks out there doing signings that are just as professional as the best full-timers. I have been retired for 11 years and have been doing signings for over ten years. I understand the costs of doing business and price my services accordingly. Yes, the big slow-down has affected ALL of us. My business is off over 70%, but good solid calls are still coming along with the lowball junk calls. Sorry for your distress, but please understand we are all in the same basket, and many of us part-timers are still acting professionally, maintaining our standards and doing without much of the income this business used to provide. I've been around long enough to believe in the old saw: "This too shall pass."

Chin up and soldier on!

Reply by Linda_H/FL on 9/20/13 5:11pm
Msg #485380

Thank you Bill - well said..

I am part time too - but assume the cost of all the work - no "using the employer's equipment" here.

I've taken my 25 years as a notary public and closing paralegal in CT to work here part time doing notary work and signings - why? Because I am fortunate enough to be able to do it part time. But this business, and the job I do, is just as important to me as if I was full time and it was my sole means of income.

Reply by jba/fl on 9/20/13 8:16pm
Msg #485405

Agree. n/m

Reply by Eonelin on 9/20/13 4:03pm
Msg #485367

The NNA is not a union just an association. For everyone to stick together you would have to unionize and demand higher wages.

Reply by CinOH on 9/20/13 4:43pm
Msg #485376

Susan I share your frustration. There are a lot of pensioners and retirees in this industry who really don't need the money. There are also housewives who are bored and want something to do. This job is a hobby for a lot of people and something to get them out of the house.

They accept very low fees and drive the pay scale down for everyone in their area. There's really not much you can do about it except stand firm on your fees and diversify into other streams of income. Signings are secondary for me and have been for a few years now. I cannot compete with someone willing to handle an edoc closing for $65 and refuse to try. There is no profit in those fees and a high opportunity cost of not pursuing something that is actually profitable.


I honestly think that five years from now $75 is going to be the norm for signings with edocs in a lot of areas. Notaries who cannot afford to slash their fees are going to be forced out and the ones willing to work for less than minimum wage will be the norm. I already see it happening. I think we all see it happening.

Also lot of notaries (especially those in economically depressed areas) are having to accept lower fees to stay working in their area because they don't have a second source of income in the household. If they don't take the $45-$65-$75 closings then they don't work because that is the going rate in their area and what the companies have become accustomed to paying because the $45-$75 notaries have driven the fees through the basement.

The belief is that notaries accepting very low fees are going to force themselves out of business. That is not true. Many of them are not working to earn a living to begin with or have some other source of income to "subsidize" their charitable notary "work."

When I was learning the marketing and pricing rope in my other endeavor I was TOLD, not asked, by other professionals to not set my fees below a certain amount. They actually told me what the bare minimum I should accept is because they did not want new people coming in driving down the fees in the industry.

Only recently have notaries begun to openly discuss what an acceptable fee is and I really think it's too late. The harm has been done. I read a LinkedIn post earlier this year from a notary who admitted that she will go more than 20 miles 1 way for $45 because she does a few a day for one particular company. People asked her if she made a profit doing that. She said she didn't know or care. She just thinks that it all works out because she does a few a day for that company. So she could be driving a couple hundred miles a day or more for a couple hundred bucks or less.

You can't compete against that. It's disheartening but there is life beyond signings. There are a lot of other ventures out there. I love doing closings too but I will not work for free or subsidize anyone's bottom line with my time, equipment, or supplies. I still do signings for companies who are willing to pay what I consider a fair fee.

Reply by Treasure Valley Notary - Tina on 9/20/13 6:13pm
Msg #485395

What? Are you Kidding???

Let's set something straight. Low fees are not a result of part time business owners or retired business owners. It is from "business owners" who don't know how to run a business. My husband is retired and has been for over 20 years now. Many here on the board are now operating part time due to the drop in loan signings.

My fees reflect me and my business only. I probably have some of the highest fees in Idaho. Now by saying that I turn down more jobs than I accept. But I also offer a high quality service which my clients appreciate. And with that I make a profit. I was just offered a whole $33 to go about 100 miles round trip. That included fax backs, but the docs will go to the borrower. Uuuggghhhh, no thank you. I have a business model plan and stick to it. I'm grateful that my husband has his retirement and we can live off of it. But how dare you or any of the other posters on this thread insinuate that I shouldn't be in business so that you have a bigger share of the pie. I run my business as a business - I am not an employee nor do I act like one. And I promote others to do the same.

By the way, someone will accept the $33 fee, or maybe something higher, but not at a fee it should be at. And that is fine. 2014 is just round the corner. Tax season always weeds out the low feeders. Not all of them, but a lot. And these people will wonder why they didn't make any money, but they worked their rears off. If you are going to whine, then whine to the right people. And more importantly for the right reason. Your real problem is saturation . . . not retirees or young notaries that live with their parents, or have several roommates.

Reply by jba/fl on 9/20/13 8:50pm
Msg #485407

Re: What? Are you Kidding???

I have to chuckle now as all through this thread I have been speaking to my screen and to these people very much the same words as you Tina. I have been close to writing:

Quit worrying about what the others are doing and do your business the way you want to do your business.
What does it matter what they are doing - do your own thing.
They are just putting themselves out of business faster...let it go.
These SS's are going to be gone soon - just say no.

I have had other choice sayings too, but I know no one wants to hear them - their little thin skins won't take it and they will fold and die.

Reply by Christine/OK on 9/20/13 6:18pm
Msg #485397

Hmmmm . . .

"that showed me what kind of character this man had. Very rude and arrogant.'

NOTE: This is not directed at anyone in particular - simply an observation . . .

I am not completely certain that this would be an accurate assessment of this individual's character simply from the standpoint that times are pretty tough everywhere.

Many CNSAs call others in another state trying to gain the client information for a colleague/friend in that same state. You know, the old bait and switch! 'I can't hurt you to tell me, I am in Alaska!'

Well, don't know in his instance, but he could have been burned by being helpful in the past and sharing information.

Or, maybe this couple doesn't have employer provided health insurance and this work pays the premiums.

It is very interesting what folks will presume about others. We can never know the crosses that another person bears unless we 'walk a mile' in their shoes.

I try not to judge. Just do my level best to be fair to all involved. Especially now, more than ever: Focus on Marketing, Marketing, and MORE Marketing. A focus on the lack of work will bring more of what one is focusing upon.

I pray several times each and every day for every one of us as these times are truly challenging. I help all that I can, but it simply does not make sense to give away your business - not that telling you where he bought it would do that, just really sounds like he has been burned pretty badly. We must try to stick together the best that we can and respect another business owner's right to hold their cards close to their chest.

jmho

Reply by Darlin_AL on 9/21/13 2:21pm
Msg #485437

rude dude, as there is such a thing as professional courtesy n/m