Posted by VT_Syrup on 1/12/12 1:36pm
Msg #408842

Postal Service to provide notarization?

Senator Bernie Sanders of Vermont has made speeches where he says he will introduce legislation to allow certain USPS employees to perform notarizations. I have not been able to find the legislation and don't know if it has actually been introduced yet.

The goal would be to increase revenue for the Postal Service so they won't have to close as many facilities and lay off as many employees.

Reply by bagger on 1/12/12 1:58pm
Msg #408845

This response may belong in JP, but here goes.

This seems to be your usual political promise you the world claptrap.
1. Mr. Sanders (is he up for reelection?) is a US Senator.
2. Notaries Public fall under the STATE SOS.
Local trumps State, State trumps Federal., ergo Mr. Sanders cannot effect Federal legislation to allow USPS employees to perform a STATE function.

Reply by HisHughness on 1/12/12 2:16pm
Msg #408848

Re: This response may belong in JP, but here goes.

Please observe the rules of this forum and do not post political material here. This was a rule of which you were obviously aware, yet chose to ignore.

Reply by Bob_Chicago on 1/12/12 3:09pm
Msg #408856

Not to mention that he was incorrect.

Certain military personnel are currently authorized to perform notorial services for military personnel and their depnendents.I do not see any legal reason that USPS personnel could not also be authorized to perform notarization pursunt to properly drawn legislation. Probably not be a good idea, but I believe that it would be legal

"Under federal law, certain U.S. military personnel -- including commissioned officers and judge advocates -- have authority to notarize for military personnel and their dependents anywhere in the world.

On the administrative and judge advocate staffs supporting your husband's unity in Iraq, there are likely numerous persons with notarial powers who can assist him."

This response probably came too late for that woman, just as this information is too late for the woman whose closing I did. But hopefully the information can benefit someone in the future who is stationed abroad and is in need of notary services. There was probably someone right there in the unit who could have done the notarization. And it's probably a power that military officers are unaware that they have. Of course, they should check to ensure that they are qualified to act in the capacity as notary.



I researched this subject at the Cornell University Law School website. This is taken from the U.S. Code:

§ 936. Art. 136. Authority to administer oaths and to act as notary

(a) The following persons on active duty or performing inactive-duty training may administer oaths for the purposes of military administration, including military justice:

(1) All judge advocates.
(2) All summary courts-martial.
(3) All adjutants, assistant adjutants, acting adjutants, and personnel adjutants.
(4) All commanding officers of the Navy, Marine Corps, and Coast Guard.
(5) All staff judge advocates and legal officers, and acting or assistant staff judge advocates and legal officers.
(6) All other persons designated by regulations of the armed forces or by statute.

(b) The following persons on active duty or performing inactive-duty training may administer oaths necessary in the performance of their duties:

(1) The president, military judge, trial counsel, and assistant trial counsel for all general and special courts-martial.
(2) The president and the counsel for the court of any court of inquiry.
(3) All officers designated to take a deposition.
(4) All persons detailed to conduct an investigation.
(5) All recruiting officers.
(6) All other persons designated by regulations of the armed forces or by statute.

Reply by bagger on 1/12/12 4:10pm
Msg #408868

Re: Not to mention that he was incorrect.

Please observe the rules of this forum and do not post political material here. This was a rule of which you were obviously aware, yet chose to ignore.

Reply by bagger on 1/13/12 10:12am
Msg #408936

How does the military compare to USPS? n/m

Reply by Cody on 1/13/12 3:28pm
Msg #408968

Re: This response may belong in JP, but here goes.

so the op informs us of something, and then speculation as to why this might happen evolves....how did HughHigHness get to some politically motivated stuff....i don't read other forums here...

seems bagger is right on target with facts...

if the post office has a notary i really don't care....$2 bucks at a time isn't going to help the country...

Reply by bagger on 1/13/12 4:04pm
Msg #408973

Re: This response may belong in JP, but here goes.

LOL, in Illinois, it's $1.00

Reply by Belinda/CA on 1/12/12 2:53pm
Msg #408852

Don't see this as anything but a post about

USPS providing Notaries in the future. Must not jive with your beliefs, Hugh, or you would have left this one alone.

Reply by pleasantonCA on 1/12/12 2:59pm
Msg #408853

Not sure if I would even consider going to PO for this

service. I have found our post office employees to be rude with very little patience.

Would they even be able to do this with all people standing in line?

Reply by Larry/IL on 1/12/12 3:03pm
Msg #408854

I AGREE !!!! n/m

Reply by HisHughness on 1/12/12 3:42pm
Msg #408862

Okay, Belinda, I'll help you...

...since you are unable to see the political nature of the post. The original poster himself acknowledged that the post might be political. The title of the post was:
THIS RESPONSE MAY BELONG IN JP

He then goes on to refer to the politics of the post in the text itself, though it must be noted it smacks of the incohency typical of this poster:
THIS SEEMS TO BE YOUR USUAL POLITICAL PROMISE YOU THE WORLD CLAPTRAP
Since you seem to have difficulty extracting meaning from things, let me point out that Bernie Sanders is a liberal independent senator who votes with the Democrats. The poster is one of the JPol far rightwing radicals.

Finally, the poster goes on to say:
1. MR. SANDERS (IS HE UP FOR REELECTION) IS A U.S. SENATOR.
I think an election is a political process; at least it is in my neck of the woods.

And in answer to your question, yes, my political beliefs are quite different from those of the poster. For one thing, I don't believe that one should put one's intellect in cold storage when forming one's political beliefs. But you see, that is the sort of thing that should be argued in Just Politics, the forum that was established for it.

Reply by jba/fl on 1/12/12 6:51pm
Msg #408884

I think your hot air has done more to

champion bagger's post than not. You are, again, going overboard due to your dislike for a person, not the post.

JMO

Reply by bagger on 1/12/12 4:36pm
Msg #408870

Re: Don't see this as anything but a post about

Actually Belinda, it's sort of a personal thing.

Reply by HisHughness on 1/12/12 5:39pm
Msg #408873

Re: Don't see this as anything but a post about

***Actually Belinda, it's sort of a personal thing.***

Actually, Belinda, it's the exact opposite; it's an attempt to keep the Discuss Work forum professional, rather than seeing it descend into the sort of personal rancor frequently displayed by the poster who started this. This is the participant who, on Just Politics, has over time called me:

A spineless bullying twit, a bully, a Marxist, a spineless socialist twit, a wacko, a lying sack o' Durbin, a two-faced SOB, a wishy washy jerk, the ultimate socialist ba$tard, an insensitive jerk, a piece of crap, and this worm, along with various and sundry adjectives. Those are only the imprecations from that particular poster; we haven't even begun to address those from his far rightwing colleagues. Nor have we looked at the names that others who disagree with the rightwingers on JPol have been called.

It is personal, very personal, on JPol. And if you want that kind of vituperation to smell up the Discuss Work forum, you just continue to turn a blind eye to politics when they intrude on this forum. For myself, I'm going to call out such posters every time, <regardless of where they fall on the political spectrum>, and I would urge others who value the professionalism of THIS forum to do the same.

If, on the other hand, you LIKE wallowing in the kind of excrement cited above, you keep patting the violators on the popo and telling them it's okay.

Reply by Carolyn Breckenridge on 1/12/12 5:46pm
Msg #408874

Re: Don't see this as anything but a post about

Why can't this be done by a PM? Instead of having others read your arguments.

Reply by HisHughness on 1/12/12 6:21pm
Msg #408880

I am befuddled by this post

***Why can't this be done by a PM? Instead of having others read your arguments.***

You expected the original poster to send his original political propaganda to everyone by PM? Or you expected everyone who wanted to respond to his political cheap shots to do so only by PM, which of course leaves his politicking without any public response? That doesn't really make much sense, unless you are one of those who want only the rightwing message offered.

What is about the concept of NOBODY, of whatever political complexion, posting politically oriented material in Discuss Work that you don't grasp? Or don't want to accept? What is it about trying to head off this forum becoming the sort of battleground that JPol became before every single progressive poster there finally got tired of the rightwing bashing and just gave up posting? The rightwingers are the only voices heard in JPol now. Do you want the same thing happening here?

Reply by Buddy Young on 1/12/12 6:50pm
Msg #408883

Re: I am befuddled by this post

Hugh, sounds like you're pissed.

Reply by Buddy Young on 1/12/12 10:55pm
Msg #408913

Re: I don't participate in political debates n/m

Reply by Carolyn Breckenridge on 1/12/12 7:06pm
Msg #408887

Re: I am befuddled by this post

I just think that a public forum is not the place to use a whole paragraph to call someone names.

We are all here to talk about our careers that we have in common. We learn and get a few laughs along the way. I want to enjoy this forum. IMO

Reply by jba/fl on 1/12/12 6:58pm
Msg #408885

My - when you get worked up, we see another different side

I wonder if your 'fan club' sees that as well. Believe me, I have been on this side of your perjorative ramblings and find that sooner or later, everyone else will be as well. You cannot help yourself nor control yourself. You are a bully - yep, a BULLY. Not that sweet, funny old man. Just because you are 75 does not give you the right to go off on people in such a manner. Why would you reduce yourself to such a level?

I only expect a vituperative response - your norm. Apology is not in your vocabulary at all. So sad you have evolved to such.

Reply by Larry/IL on 1/12/12 8:32pm
Msg #408898

Re: My - when you get worked up, we see another different side

I try to do much more reading than posting but in this case I have to agree with Julianne. I think his whining about the OP was way out of line and certainly deserved to be in J/P more than the OP. I believe he used the whining to push his political view and opinion on the rest of us. I could care less about what his political opinion is and the name calling he used. I know I will not be opening any of his future posts or responses as I don't feel they would be of any benefit.

Reply by Susan Fischer on 1/12/12 9:53pm
Msg #408907

So you'll condemn Hugh for language, but not Jules for hers

for comments like "...apology is not in your vocabulary..."?

Your post esacerbates the vitriolic, and the ignoring of the Issue.

What's your position on Notarial Commissions, Larry,?

Reply by Larry/IL on 1/12/12 9:59pm
Msg #408908

Notarial Commissions?

I think they're great, everybody should get one and jump in. The water is just fine!

Reply by Susan Fischer on 1/13/12 4:22am
Msg #408922

My point is that Notarial Commissions are not in competition

with remote closers/mobile Notaires Public in our singluar industry.

Reply by Susan Fischer on 1/12/12 9:49pm
Msg #408906

The perfect response from a JP'er, personally attacking, and

~ignoring~ the ISSUE, which is, Notarial Commissions.

It is A-POLITICAL. There is no Right or Left. It's a non-partisan issue. Nothing to do with political parties or ideaologies.

Anything to contribute about the Issue, Jules?

Reply by jba/fl on 1/13/12 12:42am
Msg #408917

Yeah - I think that USPS could do a notary

but not much else. And we all know how we feel about "do a notary".

Reply by JanetK_CA on 1/12/12 3:20pm
Msg #408859

Since the Postal Service is a self-funding organization, it reminds me most of the FedEx attempt to offer notary services. They got out of that business for liability reasons. Should they do so, USPS employees would still be obligated to follow the notary laws of the state the operate in. It wouldn't fall under Federal jurisdiction. I think that idea would work about as well as it does at many UPS stores - which is marginal, IMO. (I'm sure some do just fine, but others... well, we've heard the stories and many of us have seen the examples.)

Scary proposition, if you ask me - and not because of the competition!

Reply by VT_Syrup on 1/12/12 3:53pm
Msg #408865

I'm not sure if the federal government has the authority to turn postal employees into notaries or not. I don't know if the intent is for the federal government to directly give notary powers to postal workers, or if the idea is to have the postal employees be commissioned by the states. I guess we won't know until the bill is introduced (if ever).

Reply by JanetK_CA on 1/13/12 2:40am
Msg #408921

I don't think the federal government would need to have the authority to "directly give notary powers to postal workers". They may just need to decide to request some employees to become notaries, just like any other business. Also, I'm not aware of any situation where a zip code (and therefore a post office) crosses state boundaries, so I would imagine that all postal workers function within a state jurisdiction and could apply for, and be commissioned by, the state in which they operate - just like any other notary.

Most postal workers serve the general public - just like a FedEx office - so I don't know if the military analogy would apply, unless it was for a post office on a base somewhere. Seems to me that people are over-complicating this. BUT I don't know anything more than what's in the constitution about regulations dealing with the functions of the USPS.

Reply by Sylvia_FL on 1/12/12 3:46pm
Msg #408863

One of our local post offices provided notary services a couple of years ago, whether they still do I don't know.

Reply by Linda_in_MI on 1/12/12 3:48pm
Msg #408864

Don't see as a threat, considering

Considering that the USPS is thinking of reducing hours of operation and or closing locations, that notaries would only be available during reduced office hours, and that this would require people to travel to the post office so working against their schedule instead of working with their schedule--which for me one of my selling points about the premise behind a mobile notary--I don't see this as much of a threat or competition.

Reply by desktopfull on 1/13/12 7:38am
Msg #408925

Interesting as to how PO would charge for the use of someone's notary seal. I would think that the money would belong to the notary. Rates are different for every state, so I don't see how this would solve anything for the PO any way. Or is the government planning another take over of the private sector?

Reply by FlaNotary2 on 1/13/12 8:14am
Msg #408927

My not-so-humble opinion (you knew it was coming)

I wouldn't take my document to one of those rude, snobby post office clerks if they were the only notaries in Florida. Notarizations are best left in the hands of professional notaries like us - and when I say "professional notaries" this specifically excludes the uneducated notaries who work at UPS Store, Amscot, and the like. I've said it before and I'll say it again, we need LESS notaries, not more. Allowing USPS employees to perform notarizations is a sure fire way to get rid of state notaries all together.

I truly hope that nothing comes of this.

It isn't about competition - it is about the dignity of the public office. The more people who hold the position, the less valued the position is. And we have never been valued less than we are right now.

Reply by jnew on 1/15/12 12:00pm
Msg #409085

Re: My not-so-humble opinion (you knew it was coming)

Wisconsin has not amended their notary fees since the first seal was manufactured. You are allowed $.50 per document. If the post office sees this as an economic opportunity, they are welcome to it. Not much of a deal for either side, especially to get a document notarized in exchange for a 20 minute wait in line.